117 pointsby FinnLobsien5 hours ago11 comments
  • unknownian8 minutes ago
    GenAI that imitates human art is the definition of an anti-invention. If an invention is a new innovation that improves something for the human experience, an anti-invention is a new innovation that makes life worse.

    This is just one of several areas where GenAI has been harmful and should start getting regulated like digital drugs.

    • retwakm4a few seconds ago
      I think there are other digital technologies that are also a lot like drugs and deserve similar regulation. I.e. if your social media company decides it wants to be a platform and insert stuff to inflame you or generate more engagement....it's a drug, not a tool for social connection.
  • internet_pointsan hour ago
    > Amazon spends a lot of time and effort trying to prevent these [fake] books from getting posted,” Mary Rasenberger, the CEO of the Authors Guild, told me, “but it’s always a game of catch-up.”

    Do they really? They take a cut; they have incentives to let people get scammed.

    • dawnerd38 minutes ago
      Probably the same amount of effort spent on trying to prevent fake SSDs and usb drives.
    • rtkwe36 minutes ago
      Yes, it's a naive assumption that quality of the presented material doesn't impact consumer behavior, if they get flooded with loads of garbage books and people can't find good book they enjoy they'll stop shopping at Amazon and it doesn't matter if they make money off the slop. It's the same reason Youtube has quality filters for algorithmic feeds, if the stream gets too polluted with bad videos people will watch fewer videos.

      It's exactly the same process that's causing people to avoid expensive purchases on Amazon due to the number of fake products that have infiltrated their supply. People move on if they're sold a lot of bunk goods from a place.

      • antiframe29 minutes ago
        I don't know. For years Amazon has had a fraudulent item listing problem to the point where it's hard to trust them. They have made no effort that I have seen to solve it. I mean, why would they, their sales haven't declined.

        So, I am skeptical books will be any different than all those knock-off drop-shipped items.

        • DarkUranium14 minutes ago
          I often trust AliEx more than Amazon these days. At least one of the two isn't pretending not to be what it is.

          Plus Amazon has a long history of screwing over sellers. TL;DR if your product is actually successful, they'll make their own "Amazon Basics" version of your product, then deprioritize you (or even ban you over an excuse). They do this a lot. There's a lot more than just this, it's just an example.

        • rtkwe18 minutes ago
          I'd say that's hard to judge from the top line sales numbers, their broad sales could remain fine even when they lose larger rare purchases if they're bringing in enough new customers that are fine with only buying the slop.
      • gumby27129 minutes ago
        And yet look at all the non-book products being sold on Amazon that are all garbage. Its the same slop problem and has been for a while, but they don't seem to be addressing that either. I have to assume it doesn't impact their bottom line as much as we think it should, consumers don't (or can't) care as much as we would hope.
  • sarrephan hour ago
    > Amazon lets individuals upload a maximum of six books a week, allowing for endless churn.

    That's a book a day (give or take), per account. No human author is publishing a book per day.[0]

    It's interesting to me how little the incumbent platforms for digital content seemingly have been able to do in combating the tidal, exponential shift in submissions.

    I just spent a month developing a Shopify App, on the side, for fun. When I launched it a couple of weeks ago, I discovered an app doing the same thing as mine with an identical name had also been approved and released a week prior.

    How do people think that distribution will change now that supply has increased (at least) tenfold? If the consensus on X.com is to be believed, it's all about personal brand. This used to be the case, but perhaps 80% of it. Is conventional discovery dead now?

    [0] - If this includes organisations, like publishing houses, then fair enough. But realistically we should be able to distinguish actual authors.

  • barbariangrunge28 minutes ago
    Its the reverse turing test: can a human convince another human (or bot screener) that they are human?

    We need legislation banning ai from imitating/impersonating humans and creating confusion about whats real. And people using ai to make their art need to label it or else theyre just plagarizing

    I mean, even ghost writers arent making the world a better place

    • fantasizr11 minutes ago
      it seems like a slam dunk that we should own our likeness legally, but the scam lobby is very powerful at the moment
  • SamInTheShellan hour ago
    We could just say "AI has destroyed trust" and it's accurate.

    First hand experiences myself:

    I can't commission an artist without questioning if they are using AI, which isn't acceptable in the projects I am commissioning for.

    I can't trust that my coworkers are actually testing the crap they're generating before wasting my time with runbooks that aren't even validated. It was bad enough that people miss important steps with assumed knowledge, but now we have that amplified by these types of documents that are no being AI generated.

    I can't trust that my code wont be sucked up by some money greedy company at speeds unheard of before and benefit someone with out any credit to me doing something novel or interesting.

    Even worse, I can't trust the smart people to not be idiots either. How many engineers do you know that have completely outsourced all the thinking to the robot, while we know fully that it's closer to a slot machine than it is a thinking machine?

    Maybe even worse than that is the companies thinking they can reduce 10% of their workforce and compensate with LLMs. It's absolutely laughable, because I witnessed it first hand. Company I worked at fired my recruiter and the guy that was going to be my boss before my start date. My onboarding was practically non-existent and nobody wants to train their newbies anymore. The fear of being axed from your job at the first thing that MIGHT make a profit is also high. To every company that retained me through their layoffs, joke is on them, people like me want to see stability and that's just fiscal irresponsibility they're signalling.

    Just some thoughts to illustrate it's not just writing. Trust is destroyed in any creative and professional en devour at this point.

    • forgetfreeman38 minutes ago
      "Maybe even worse than that is the companies thinking they can reduce 10% of their workforce and compensate with LLMs"

      It's significantly dumber than that. Companies are paying to pour all of their domain and institutional knowledge, processes, and data into the training pipeline of tools their competitors use. Even better, they ignore the fact that as these tools gain competency the owners of these systems are guaranteed to start spinning up integrated industry verticals in direct competition.

      • moron4hire21 minutes ago
        Tried to tell that to my executive suite and they told me I was being ridiculous. Showed them OpenAIs "digital program management" for USG projects and it was like they suddenly went blind. Half a beat later it was like I never uttered a word and they were back to talking about "becoming a leader in AI." We're a fucking consulting company that can't even put small, hand written projects written by domain experts in front of the client because of our joke of an IT department. We're never going to credibly be "leaders in AI."
  • glitchcan hour ago
    When reading takes more effort than writing, trust is inevitably a victim.
  • ericmayan hour ago
    This is multi-faceted and I agree that AI is destroying some levels of trust, but many of the publications on the Internet were never deserving of trust anyway so I'd describe it as formalizing or recognizing distrust or lack of credibility and, in a manner of speaking now that the tide is going out we can see who has been swimming naked.

    One of the other facets is the idea that trust is now being lost due to AI. It's unfortunate that it seems that publications like The Atlantic (and others) are now going to scapegoat the lost of trust that they've earned over the last decade or so to be about AI when it's actually about bad, biased writing with a default point of view, and lack of intellectual honesty and an inability to facilitate intellectual debate and discussion.

    As some of these publications continue to spiral into irrelevancy I think what is a bit tragic is they'll never really understand why. They'll blame AI, which will likely destroy all but the top-tier sites, but in reality the quality of the writing and honesty went down the drain next to their ad-filled garbage pages and other spam.

  • imhkeran hour ago
    [dead]
  • susBhviralStudy3 hours ago
    > Ever since, I’d worried that the misrepresentation might somehow have a real-life impact

    Doubt is good for the brain & mind.

    But either the author is AI or she--Rachel Kadish, born in '69--needed something AI related to write about.

    There is no trust between writers & readers. People either distrust and scrutinize or they like or dislike how the reading went. Some don't even judge but just shrug it off whatever impact the reading might have had.

    The problem is that the AI conversation is reinforcing cultural polarity, especially among experts and people who are at least well enough off, so any methods to ignore the actual problems, which have been ignored in the past by most people almost by convention, are welcome and this article seems, at least to me, to be the result of one of these applied methods.

    • FinnLobsien3 hours ago
      > There is no trust between writers & readers. People either distrust and scrutinize or they like or dislike how the reading went. Some don't even judge but just shrug it off whatever impact the reading might have had.

      I interpret this more as an underlying social contract: Both writing a book and reading it used to be laborious. Now they're not.

      Reaching out to an author about specific details used to mean you've deeply engaged with the work. Writing a book used to mean you spent lots of time understanding and writing about the topic.

      Neither is now true, so it makes it harder to distinguish what's worth paying attention to.

      I've definitely seen this happen with myself. When I shop for books, I do extra research into the author and publisher for anything published after 2022.

      • baldursdevan hour ago
        Agreed I also think, what unique perspective am I getting if it's just AI? If I want to know what AI thinks I could ask it myself, I want more diverse opinions.
        • JumpCrisscrossan hour ago
          Bingo. I read plenty of AI writing. My AI writes it for me. The way I like it. Usually along with obvious action items already drafted.

          There may be a market for sharing useful prompt ideas. There isn’t one—broadly—for sharing the outputs.

    • asplake3 hours ago
      > There is no trust between writers & readers. People either distrust and scrutinize or they like or dislike how the reading went. Some don't even judge but just shrug it off whatever impact the reading might have had.

      That suggests that writer reputation and the reader’s past experience are of no importance. But before you even get to read something, you have to decide to do so. On what basis? And how might a bad experience colour future decisions?

  • EarlKingan hour ago
    [flagged]
    • throwayay58373an hour ago
      While lacking in kindness, this comment does point the dropping trust in the institution of journalism.

      AI feels like a red herring as I've always considered the root of the problem to be cultural, ie. journalists adding story (ala New Journalism) because that gets attention but often results in sloppy arguments or subpar investigative work.

    • totallymikean hour ago
      If you don't trust the Atlantic, don't read the Atlantic. Do you honestly believe every journalist is out here lying to you? Who do you trust to provide information to you, if not journalists, and what about the people you do trust makes them different from journalists?

      Additionally, I'd say this argument doesn't really address the point that chatbots, AI news farms, and rapid copycat books being generated by LLMs flooding the market cause confusion in every conceivable market.

      • eleventen32 minutes ago
        I believe that most journalists are writing stories that confirm their own priors because that’s what all humans have done since forever.

        I also believe that today’s journalists cut their teeth in the Buzzfeed era when industry incentives were to write as much clickbait as fast as possible.

        Journalism is eroding its own credibility. Or, market incentives are. I don’t think journalists are cartoon villains, simply humans who have been put on a pedestal that is no longer earned.

        If I want to know about something now, I go find an expert in that thing and read their book, not a beat reporter.

    • KaiserProan hour ago
      How very generic.

      Look, it is incredibly easy to say "all journalist are lying"

      The problem is, normally that opinion is pushed by a specific group who will benefit from those journalists being discredited.

      Now, with genai getting really rather good, there isn't really much between us and fully automatic bullshit as a service. Bad twitter, reddit & bluesky are very good examples of that. There are legions of people who are convinced that x is y, because someone spend some money to spread shit.

      Sure, bad journalists need to be called out, as do bad networks (doesn't help that monopolies are fucking US journalism now)

      but writing everyone off, without cause? thats just gonna let the grifters win.