87 pointsby DeepLogin3 hours ago13 comments
  • jck8627 minutes ago
    The AI companies must be regulated. They are already destroying the world and the economy before they can even make an attempt at destroying humanity.

    Either AI will get cheap enough and blow up and destroy the economy by eating everyone's lunch and killing off sectors left and right. Or it will become an uncontrolable weapon destroying the internet and killing off people on the battlefield. Or it will tank the economy because there may not be a way to monopolize it making the billions of investments moot leading them to their only leverage of hoarding up all the resources pricing out the competition but also destroying the industry. And maybe all of those at once.

  • 1shooner15 minutes ago
    An aside, this is a poorly-structured article. It's mostly screenshots of citations from other articles with no alt or any other way to actually search through what they're citing.
  • glimshe2 hours ago
    Should we blame this on memory companies or the AI companies bidding for memory? How should the memory companies have acted differently?
    • swdev2816342 hours ago
      I think the epic mistake was made by investors and executives who bought tales about imminent super-intelligence about to displace millions of knowledge workers from entire industries replacing them with AI datacentres.

      These people are the main reason why AI companies have unlimited funding, and can afford to buy global RAM supply for years in the future despite their expenses exceed revenue by billions.

      • benced2 hours ago
        You can short them and make a lot of money (to buy RAM with?) if you feel this way and are correct.
        • BLKNSLVRan hour ago
          Not having the money to buy a new computer often means not having the money to put where ones mouth is.

          Can't afford thing? Gamble on stock market instead.

          Ridiculous argument that already rich people make.

        • dragonwriteran hour ago
          Google (which is diversified more and whose performance is less likely to track AI outcomes closely) aside, the two other members of the AI Big 3 are non-public, so, no, you really can’t.
        • demibabsan hour ago
          No?

          Shorting doesn’t only require you to be right. It requires perfectly timing when the market will realize you’re right.

          • an hour ago
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          • dist-epochan hour ago
            You can buy long term put options.
            • philipovan hour ago
              That still requires perfect timing. Getting the timing right on a long-term contract is even harder than with a short-term contract!
              • Maxatar38 minutes ago
                How does buying long term put options require perfect timing? The whole point of a long term put option is that you only have to be right at some point between when you buy it and when it expires.
                • SpicyLemonZest20 minutes ago
                  No, put options suffer from time decay and IV crush. A $1,000 MU put for December 2027 was at about $200 today. So if Micron dropped tomorrow, you'd probably start making a bit of money, although the delta is only -0.32. But if you held all the way to December 2027, Micron would then have to drop all the way to $800 before your position is profitable.

                  When and how that transition happens is subject to a number of complex factors, and it's not even necessarily the case that incremental drops in the stock will produce incremental gains for your put option.

              • dcrazy35 minutes ago
                The point of LEAPS is you don’t have to perfect the timing. You buy far enough out to avoid theta decay, and far enough out of the money to minimize risk.
                • philipov33 minutes ago
                  Regardless of timing, for shorts to pay out requires the market to actually correct itself. You won't be able to get your magical shorts money until the price of ram goes back down anyway. The market will remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.
                  • dcrazy22 minutes ago
                    The price of RAM does not need to come down in order for a way-out-of-the-money January 2027 put on NVDA to increase in value from its current purchase price.
        • swdev281634an hour ago
          Can I? Neither OpenAI nor Anthropic are publicly traded.
        • vor_an hour ago
          With non-public companies?
      • amelius2 hours ago
        The main tool to fix this is to forbid companies to sell below cost price. It is part of antitrust law.
      • dist-epochan hour ago
        The same thing was said 4 years ago about NVIDIA on HN, that it's stock it's outrageously overpriced, given it's $20 bln revenue, that it should have at least 10 times more revenue to justify that stock price, which is fantasy, that there is no plausible way for such demand no matter what you think about GPT-2.
        • swdev281634an hour ago
          nVidia earning is way above zero by a healthy margin. This was also true 4 years ago. How much their shares should cost is debatable but still, nVidia is obviously a profitable business.

          Anthropic net loss in 2025 was $42 bln, OpenAI $38.5 bln. Both are spending enormous amounts with no obvious path to profitability.

        • elzbardicoan hour ago
          The market can remain irrational far longer than you can stay solvent.
    • CBLT2 hours ago
      I'd come at this from a different angle: we still want this to be market system, so we need to make this priced into the market. How can we price this in?

      I would try to solve this by making the market structure reflect the underlying difficulty: we have to decide what capacity to produce years in advance, to construct the memory fabs. So this should be a futures market, and a capacity crunch would affect short-term-futures, but leave full term futures at the same price. Because the companies supplying the memory can just construct more capacity to fill those futures at the same cost regardless of the AI demand.

      • marcosdumayan hour ago
        Well, the best way to solve this problem keeping it a market system is if consumers band together and create a fab that will supply them.

        Since almost everybody is a consumer of those companies, I do suggest we reuse the governance system we have that solves other "everybody problems".

      • paimapian hour ago
        ah yes, adding a futures market to a sector heavily invested in AI certainly won't lead to catastrophic over-speculation that will collapse the industry entire
    • izacusan hour ago
      > How should the memory companies have acted differently?

      Same way nVidia did through the crypto insanity - make sure they're supplying enough to the consumer market so it doesn't get completely destroyed and pulls down the other parts of the consumer market they're reliant for long term success.

      > Should we blame this on memory companies or the AI companies bidding for memory?

      Blame doesn't change the outcomes, neither does it improve the negative consequences. Think in terms of "what does destruction of our consumer market mean for my prosperity?" not "oh, how do defend poor companies again?"

    • SlightlyLeftPad2 hours ago
      For one, they could have could have not massively scaled back consumer memory manufacturing as a matter of duty to customers. But money and greed must prevail.
      • Cyan4882 hours ago
        Isn't it the case that public companies owe a primary legal/fiduciary duty to shareholders over customers?

        The question of choice between a profitable vs unprofitable venture is easy. But yeah, to what extent is choosing profitable instead of VERY profitable a breach of duty to shareholders?

        • csnover2 hours ago
          As far as I am aware, the answer to your question is ‘no’[0].

          > Contrary to what many believe, U.S. corporate law does not impose any enforceable legal duty on corporate directors or executives of public corporations to maximize profits or share price. The economic case for shareholder-value maximization similarly rests on incorrect factual claims about the structure of corporations, including the mistaken claims that shareholders “own” corporations, that they have the only residual claim on the firm’s profits, and that they are principals who hire and control directors to act as their agents.

          [0] https://corpgov.law.harvard.edu/2012/06/26/the-shareholder-v...

        • WarmWashan hour ago
          >Isn't it the case that public companies owe a primary legal/fiduciary duty to shareholders

          The shareholders own the company. It is their property. They paid for it, they own it, and likewise they can do whatever they want with it.

          It would be crazy if I proposed you let me drive your car to work everyday. Why? Because you own your car, it's your property, and it works for your own interest. Basically every human agrees with this logic, but somehow "the company is just focused on pleasing shareholders" escapes this.

          • dcrazy20 minutes ago
            This is not at all how share ownership works. You don’t have partial title to a corporation by owning shares.
        • torginus35 minutes ago
          This is like asking how many times can a politician can break his word before people vote for the other guy.

          It's more like voting for public officials. Shareholders can vote to fire a CEO if they feel he's not acting in their best interests no mattter if that's the case or not.

        • izacusan hour ago
          No, and I don't know who keeps teaching you that nonsense.
        • elzbardico42 minutes ago
          And what does that mean?

          Raid your own assets, cut costs manically so you can have a few splendid quarters with stock buyback bonanza or focus on long term value creation, which a lot of times involves giving at least a passing tought to other stakeholders such as client and employees?

          The getting was great for some time for HP shareholders under Fiorina, or GE shareholders under Welch. Lots of them left the sinking ships at the right moment, but I bet that lot of the others left holding the bag, would have preferred having bought AAPL.

        • micromacrofoot2 hours ago
          fiduciary duty doesn't mean you always have to do what makes the maximum profit

          avoiding the destruction of good faith with consumers is a legitimate business interest

          • pessimizeran hour ago
            Good faith with customers also has a monetary value, even if it is hard to calculate. This is still maximizing profits.
    • micromacrofoot2 hours ago
      both of them

      memory companies could have attempted to protect consumers, at least a little, but the AI money machine goes brrrr

    • amelius2 hours ago
      > How should the memory companies have acted differently?

      Well if your thesis is that they should have acted differently, then we should blame the laissez-faire capitalists.

    • iwontberude2 hours ago
      [dead]
  • eagerpace2 hours ago
    People have the option of just not buying stuff. I sold my Tesla in 2021 for a stupid price, drove a beater for two years, and bought another new car a couple years later. Now, certainly not everyone has that luxury, but this is computers, not real estate. Prices will crash.
    • PorciiVorbescan hour ago
      >People have the option of just not buying stuff.

      Unless you know, your main and only PC/notebook just died and need a replacement ASAP, they you don't really have an option to not buy. And no, the used market (where I live) is just as fucked, proportionally reflecting the retail gouging, with people wanting quite a lot of cash for tower PCs and notebooks from the Pentium 4 - Core 2 Duo era.

      > Prices will crash.

      Does your crystal ball also say when exactly? If my laptop broke, then I need a replacement now in the overpriced market, not in X years when prices will crash.

      • twochillinan hour ago
        If there were such a crystal ball, the same market doing the gouging would be pricing it in already ;) does suck that "wait and see" is the optimal answer to the average consumer but I guess that's the capitalist hellscape we have wrought
    • EvanAndersonan hour ago
      If this goes on long enough the prices crashing won't matter because the manufacturers of all the other PC hardware will be gone.

      I think we're seeing the end of the PC as we know it, personally.

    • Varelionan hour ago
      I hope so. I feel so, so, so terribly guilty for not building my wife a computer for her in 2023. She is rocking a 1080ti, and I really wish I had at least upgraded her system, but now I just straight cannot afford to even consider it, given the price of rent, food, gas, energy, all on top of the actual hardware prices.

      And I am a SWE.I am not making bad money. I can't imagine what others are going through.

      • ASalazarMX42 minutes ago
        I was so lucky to buy a high-end miniPC to replace my home PC for about $1,500 USD in 2025. The same model now sells for more than $8,000 USD, without disk or RAM. Triple that if you match my original disk and RAM buy. Everything got incredibly expensive, not only storage and RAM.
    • izacusan hour ago
      Way to miss the whole point of the article and fail to understand the point. Do you think if significant part of US industry goes bankrupt because they can't source parts for their products, work machines and consumers disappear... you'll still have luxury of running around in a Tesla?
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  • Seattle3503an hour ago
    Could this be the opening China needs to get their foot in the door? This feels short sighted.
    • edude0341 minutes ago
      yeah CMXT is likely to come online in the not too distant future
  • Apreche2 hours ago
    Yes, but zoom out more. Wealth inequality and the k-shaped economy are the real culprit.

    When a few people have so much wealth that they are no longer price-sensitive, they bid up the price of everything and anything of value be it stocks, real estate, computer hardware, fine arts, sports teams, etc.

    The result is that a business which tries to make quality products at reasonable prices will fail. They aren’t luxurious enough for the people with money. They aren’t cheap enough for the people without. Customers in the middle hardly exist. Any valuable good that is genuinely scarce will inevitably become a luxury.

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  • pessimizeran hour ago
    This comes at a perfect time. The public doesn't need computers, they can just use their phones.

    If the consumer had access to this RAM, they might all just run local or semi-local AI. It's important to outbid them so you can rent AI to them, and extract money from them in a million other ways while they use it.

    • zamadatixan hour ago
      Make RAM half the price it was before and you'd still have very few people trying to do local AI on it because it's just so damn slow for the task. Having 12 channels of DDR5 in an Epyc system with NVMe storage is still one of the slowest ways I can run LLMs locally.
      • ASalazarMX38 minutes ago
        Funny, I'm running local LLMs in a modest iMac M4, they are slow indeed but not utterly slow. A dedicated system should be way faster I'd guess.
    • strikingan hour ago
      Did you dodge the phone price increase somehow? Phones also need RAM (and ambitions of running local models)
  • fhn43 minutes ago
    just stop buying. you people buy way too much crap anyway
  • annoyingnoob3 hours ago
    Same for small business or any small buyer.
  • dist-epoch2 hours ago
    > The DRAM and NAND flash manufacturers at fault for the ongoing RAM, SSD, and GPU price increases

    Yes, it's the manufacturers fault, not the unbelievable market demand.

    We are all Capitalists, until the Market comes after the stuff we love.

    • izacusan hour ago
      > We are all Capitalists, until the Market comes after the stuff we love.

      Anyone with half a brain isn't a "Capitalist" (with a big C, like in your example) which is why every single prosperous nation (including USA) regulates markets to avoid destruction of their prosperity and society.

      • MrDrMcCoyan hour ago
        Colloquial "capitalism" today is just cronyism that in no way resembles the capitalism that Adam Smith wrote about. We really should move towards Rhine Capitalism, the only system that has stood the test of time and truly benefits everyone.
        • fhn39 minutes ago
          Adam Smith wrote about the invisible hand and let the free market run. What ended up happening?
          • fragmede20 minutes ago
            He also wrote about the problem with monopolies, but that was later on in his book so we forgot to do that part so the market isn't properly free.
          • iamnothere4 minutes ago
            He only used that metaphor a few times, and he did not attribute the sort of mystical power to the metaphor that modern neoliberal economists do. He never proposed the modern extreme interpretation of the concept, nor did he suggest that government should release all control over the economy.

            Marx treated Smith rather favorably, and credits him for first understanding that labor in general is what creates value. Smith is best understood as an early pioneer in understanding political economy and trade. He likely wouldn’t recognize or understand the capitalism of today (nor would Marx).

    • well_ackshuallyan hour ago
      >We are all Capitalists

      1/ speak for yourself

      2/ where is your capital and your means of production? Your machines? Your factories? Your raw materials, your tools? How long do you survive tomorrow when you quit your job and you have no other income?

      You're not a capitalist. You're just a consumer for them to suck dry. The faster you learn it, the better off you will be.

      • graemep40 minutes ago
        You are right. People are misusing "capitalist" to mean someone who favours a capitalist system, where as it actually means someone who posses capital; someone whose relies on possession of assets rather than earned income.
  • mrtksnan hour ago
    In the past people just starved to death when someone needed all the resources for their thing. Sounds like improvement.
  • throwaway81523an hour ago
    > Memory companies

    Someone misspelled "Altman", https://www.mooreslawisdead.com/post/sam-altman-s-dirty-dram...

    • xlayn40 minutes ago
      Someone misspelled let's tax ai companies until we get back to balance.