199 pointsby speckx2 hours ago14 comments
  • wnevets34 minutes ago
    > The CDC Has a Cyclospora Lab. DOGE Downsized It Last Year [1]

    [1] https://www.wired.com/story/cdc-cyclospora-lab-doge-downsize...

    • dgellow31 minutes ago
      DOGE will be seen by historians as the cause of so many crisis…
      • cyanydeez26 minutes ago
        optimistic, this requires the arc of history to bend towards non-fascism.
        • dgellow14 minutes ago
          Fair. Though based on previous experiments fascist regimes aren’t that stable and competent, they have a tendency to self-destruct once they are in power. It’s a sad state of affairs that is considered optimistic
    • a3mrouter121 minutes ago
      Impressive results! How does it compare to existing solutions on cost?
    • limagnolia20 minutes ago
      Too bad that article doesn't have any evidence that the alleged cuts have had any impact on the cyclospora response.
      • bix68 minutes ago
        You think an agency with less people can more capably do its job? Come on now.
  • sharps_xp2 hours ago
    I went to restaurant last night and asked where the chicken was sourced from and their response was "it's not the usual place we get chicken, but it's US Farm Raised Hatched", but I misinterpreted the her answer as a distributor name but then I realized even if I had a name, I probably couldn't figure out past that whether or not these chickens were pasture raised. If food labels are law, why doesn't this apply to where restaurants source their ingredients?
    • maxsilveran hour ago
      This, but unironically

      https://youtu.be/G__PVLB8Nm4

    • Miner49eran hour ago
      Restaurants don't even have to track and disclose what allergens their food contains.
      • rhinoceraptoran hour ago
        It's crazy how nothing has been done in the US about this. I got an egg allergy in my late 20s, I had never thought about it before and now eating at restaurants is such a hassle. Even the delivery apps seem to have zero affordances for food allergies, at least with a restaurant you can get some assurance by asking the staff.
        • wil42141 minutes ago
          The places I worked over 15 years ago had extensive lists of allergens. They were mostly chain or corporate, I think the mom and pop places did a little guessing. I wouldn’t trust them.
        • tokioyoyo42 minutes ago
          I’m very sorry to hear that, but I don’t think restaurants have to be forced to deal with that. The only thing I could support is “if revenue >X then allergen disclosure is mandatory”. I know personally multiple little shops that had to refuse customers, because that’s extra hassle and responsibility that they can’t afford to deal with.
          • thomascountz19 minutes ago
            In my experience in NYC kitchens, I wouldn't trust most restaurants to actually be able to accommodate certain allergies. If it isn't stated clearly on the menu, I would rather be turned away, than have an inexperienced kitchen try to manage something they haven't done before. My experience is different now that I live in the EU.
          • jsjisiiss34 minutes ago
            They manage fine in Europe. It’s a cultural issue. If you can’t be arsed working through the minor administrative hassle once (how often do you change the menu..) to not kill your customers then you shouldn’t be in this business.
          • slopinthebag13 minutes ago
            Do you also think businesses shouldn’t need to be “forced” to deal with accessibility? Web devs shouldn’t be forced to deal with accessibility either right?
      • M95Dan hour ago
        • rafram26 minutes ago
          Very, very poorly enforced and followed.
          • tpm20 minutes ago
            Depends on the country, as enforcing that falls to the agencies of the member states. At least here in Slovakia it is followed very strictly, but then our restaurant inspectors are notoriously business unfriendly.
      • ecshaferan hour ago
        Good. Restaurants are hectic to work in. Menus can change quickly, and many dishes are being cooked and prepped at once. Cross contamination chances are high, so if a restaurant MUST say an allergen is not in X,Y,Z they basically can't have it in their restaurant at all.
        • pricechild42 minutes ago
          They manage here in the UK.

          When entering, "any allergens or intolerances" is normally asked before you're sat down. They distinguish the two to decide whether a station clean is required or if they can just point you to the menu.

          If it's not already clear on the menu, most medium/large chains then hand you a tablet letting you filter by almost anything.

        • saghm43 minutes ago
          Alternately, they could truthfully state what allergens are in literally all of their foods, and then people who are allergic to them can safely avoid them, which is what you're expecting them to do now except without actually saying which allergens they are.
        • jsjisiiss32 minutes ago
          In forty years I have very rarely seen menus change substantially.

          If you are working with food you should know about allergies. It just comes with the territory. I’m baffled by how this is somehow too hard for US folks yet we manage fine.

          • failbuffer14 minutes ago
            Your menus don't change because of the administrative overhead. In the mid-sized American city where I live, menus change seasonally at nice restaurants and daily at really nice restaurants. Even fast food chains experiment with adding new items all the time.
        • dgellow28 minutes ago
          The rest of the world has been able to solve that issue
    • estearum2 hours ago
      Are food labels required to identify where they're sourced from? I don't think so?
      • stronglikedanan hour ago
        The new QR codes (to replace the 2D UPCs) that manufacturers and merchants are moving to will contain source information and even which lot it came from.
      • bushbaba2 hours ago
        It’s not but they should list country of origin for the ingredients
        • sgcan hour ago
          In the US I also want to know State of Origin. Not all state food and agricultural department regulations and inspections are the same.
        • pc862 hours ago
          "Should" or "are required to?"
          • ssl-344 minutes ago
            For some things like meat, eggs, and milk: The USDA-inspected processing facility is required to be listed on the package. It is usually not very far-removed from the farm. It's coded, and these days it's usually printed near the sell-by date.

            They (the USDA) publish cross-references betwixt the codes and the processing plants.

            It's been kind of a pain in the ass when I've looked this stuff up in the past and I wish someone would take it upon themselves to make it easier, but it's do-able.

          • sgcan hour ago
            Regulations are minimal compared to what most consumers would want and expect.

            https://www.ams.usda.gov/rules-regulations/cool

          • tyrean hour ago
            Depends on the thing. Olive oil, for example, is required to list its country/countries of origin
    • ajmurmann2 hours ago
      I wonder how high the ongoing implementation cost of that would be and how that would affect choice between small, specialized and large, integrated suppliers. Sysco can probably hand me a single sheet I can use without any extra work.
      • jmolean hour ago
        I think if you watch video of a massive meatpacking plant, you'll pretty quickly realize how hard it would be to track. At the commodity scale, basically no one in the supply chain other than the rancher seems to care where the meat comes from. And the brands (Tyson, Smithfield, etc.) only want consumers to care about the logo on the box.

        Literally the canonical example of capitalism-as-meat-grinder.

        • Atotalnoob3 minutes ago
          Meat is already tracked to its origin. They can track a specific box to the farmer and supplier.

          Anytime there would be a recall, they would include the lot number and manufacturer dates.

          Source: I worked in meat packing and boutique butcher shops.

          Edit: even things like ground beef from trimmings, we would write down every lot that went into it

        • saghm40 minutes ago
          So you're saying that this type of regulation would force the food industry to start caring about whether their food comes from? That sounds like an argument in favor of it, not against it
        • Danoxan hour ago
          Tyson and Smithfield are the worst two brands in the USA that you can get any meat from.
        • sharps_xpan hour ago
          trying to convert a massive meatpacking plan isn't step 1. it's too big a problem. that's top down. probably easier bottom up -- have a processing plant that only sources from ranchers that grass feed/finish, pasture raise, and slowly subsidize other ranchers to stop sending their product to massive meatpacking plants.
        • forlorn_mammoth40 minutes ago
          also the canonical example of a commodity. Basically the claim that all units are fully fungible.
    • dyauspitr2 hours ago
      Seems like more bureaucracy that would make it even harder for new restaurants to get set up and the paperwork they would have to maintain in order to provide that information.
      • jsjisiiss29 minutes ago
        We have enough “restaurants” that fry an egg. We can do that ourselves. Running a proper business requires such formalities to not kill your customers. If knowing about your craft is too hard - allergies is a major part of it - then you shouldn’t be in this business.
        • SoftTalker11 minutes ago
          Restaurants are one of the classic immigrant paths to upward mobility. We don't want to make that too hard.

          By all means, get a license, food handler permit, etc. and know and practice good food safety, and buy ingredients from legitimate wholesalers. But at some point you don't have visibility into the supply chain and it's not reasonable to expect Joe's Taco Truck to know which specific farms produced their lettuce.

      • pbhjpbhjan hour ago
        I've thought about this a lot as it's effectively my idea of Origin Marks (not the same as the curvy OM/GI system), that are like trade marks but they serve the consumer rather than the companies.

        Anyway, all companies have lists of what they buy and who from in their accounts - and their banks and suppliers can corroborate those details.

        I think I'd provide limits for micro-businesses (1-2 employees, below the VAT threshold in UK), and maybe have limited reporting for SMEs too. Only listing all suppliers, say.

        But for larger businesses, they should list the goods/services they use and the origin of all inputs to a product (including energy). Down to the factory, not a trade mark, the actual inputs.

        Companies already keep all this information.

        Capitalism supposedly optimises markets, but it can't do anything like that without full information. I mean the psychological manipulation of 'brand marketing' also opposes the supposed optimisations of capitalism too, but that's another story.

        All this information is already maintained, it's just not exposed for the public.

        What farm was my chicken produced on? Then I can look at that farm to see if they bought a tonne of penicillin, or a GM feed. I can look at the farm to see if they have outside access for the birds, say.

        We can also readily graph essential businesses for food security, and new companies can easily find suppliers, B2B companies can find gaps and opportunities - the whole web of production can be mapped this way.

        You can also spot corruption and loss. Consumers can avoid companies that use upstream suppliers they disprove of - like if a footwear company has a factory in an area known for human rights abuses, that's now public info, I can check it out if I want.

        Anyway, restaurants already have to know the origin of their goods for pubic health purposes, codifying can just mean the suppliers send them an enhanced receipt that the restaurant catenates with others and uploads to the government, that can be done as part of the same process as finance reporting.

        If you're buying chicken out the back of a van in an alley then you're going to have extra work; if you're just using standard supply chains it should all work pretty seamlessly.

      • inigyouan hour ago
        How hard would it be for them to know their immediate supplier?
      • saghm42 minutes ago
        If we can't figure out a way as a society to honestly tell people what food is being sold in restaurants, maybe we shouldn't be starting new restaurants until we figure that out.
        • ssl-319 minutes ago
          Knowing the sources of the food we eat is a very popular thing right now.

          Isn't the capitalist way to solve this to build new restaurants that do openly provide the lineage for the food that they sell?

          All of the consumers who are motivated by this information will then be free to reward these eateries with their business.

          After that: Other restaurateurs will surely notice how unspeakably profitable these loyal consumers are and will begin to do mimic the effort to try to capture a slice of the pie.

          Ultimately, this snowballs into information being the norm instead of the rare exception. Everyone wins!

          (Or, more likely: We'll broadly forget that we cared about any of this a few months from now, just as we have always done in the past, and the idea will die at the invisible hand of the free market.)

      • an hour ago
        undefined
      • vkou2 hours ago
        Such are the wages of destroying trust in the supply chain.

        When you elect visibly corrupt people who promised to destroy that trust upstream, you double the burden for everyone downstream from them.

        Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

  • senthil_rajasek2 hours ago
    I have not been following this very closely but it seems like the source of this cyclospora contamination has been very challenging to identify.

    Especially because it takes weeks before the infected start showing symptoms.

    Isn't it reasonable to update the official statement as new information emerges?

    "When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?” -John Maynard Keynes.

    • Wistar2 hours ago
      I have gone down that quote’s rabbit hole before and it looks a lot more apocryphal than Maynard.

      https://quoteinvestigator.com/2011/07/22/keynes-change-mind/

    • Danoxan hour ago
      Explosive diarrhea doesn’t take long to show up, and it may be hard to identify which company or who’s responsible when you fired all of the people from the department that it’s supposed to police those type of things.
      • godwinson__4-8an hour ago
        Isn't the "explosive" superfluous?

        Isn't all diarrhea explosive? Has anyone had "unexplosive" diarrhea? Or what aspect of the ordinance renders it "explosive"? And the cause is essentially exposure of the foodstuffs (in this case, likely leafy greens) to feces?

        So poop causes poop.

        Who pooped in my salad :(

        • hightrixan hour ago
          As an IBS enjoyer, no, not all diarrhea is explosive.
        • dgellow22 minutes ago
          No, it’s actually one of the symptom, it is described as explosive, not a standard diarrhea
        • fsloth6 minutes ago
          To me "explosive" means it comes unannounced and evacuates bowels within few seconds, ovepowering any sphincter resistance.

          If that's your normal poop maybe seek medical advice.

        • Tostinoan hour ago
          No, from what I have heard "explosive" isn't being treated with enough weight.

          Not all diarrhea is "explosive". This is worse than your average food poisoning from everything i've read (luckily, no personal experience so far).

          • godwinson__4-834 minutes ago
            >No, from what I have heard "explosive" isn't being treated with enough weight.

            Hmm I had not heard this, that is concerning. Thank you for sharing. No more salad for me, thanks.

    • falcor84an hour ago
      > Especially because it takes weeks before the infected start showing symptoms.

      I just wanted to say that your phrasing here is a fabulously ominous one for the first episode of an HBO show.

    • pederan hour ago
      And TBF, I don't think they've established why the issue is so prevalent in Michigan specifically, since Taylor Farms apparently doesn't have any unique connection to Michigan.
    • gazebo2an hour ago
      Took me a sec to realize you weren't quoting the guy from Tool lol
    • TylerE2 hours ago
      What changed is that right after the CEO visited the White House, a retraction was issued. This White House does not have a history of being factual, but does have a history of doing "favors" for big donors, which Taylor Farms is.
      • dabraham1248an hour ago
        Mostly to be a pedantic devil's advocate here, I'm going to argue with something you're not saying. I've heard a _lot_ of people argue that the visit is _proof_ of corruption. You're just pointing out the possibility and I'm hoping to head off a bad path.

        Anyway, if a company is being declared the source of a multi-state outbreak, that company _should_ be talking to the WH. And it's possible that some of those discussions would present evidence that _should_ result in a retraction.

        For example, during heartbleed my grand-boss was in on calls with the WH (I don't work on openssl, at the time I worked on a product that _used_ openssl a couple of layers down). AIUI, official guidance changed because of those calls.

        If we want to find proof of corruption, this is a place to start looking, not a place to stop.

      • senthil_rajasek2 hours ago
        Thanks.
    • iwontberudean hour ago
      Deficit spending the biggest ponzi ever invented. Thanks Keynes
      • inigyouan hour ago
        Fiat currency (including bitcoin) is a bigger ponzi, and the stock market (including crypto project tokens) is a bigger ponzi than that.
  • cube002 hours ago
    It's next level for a family owned company act like they have stock holders to please by cutting corners rather then doing the right thing.
    • Aurornisan hour ago
      > family owned company act like they have stock holders

      A family owned company does have shareholders. The shareholders are the people who own the company.

      There’s nothing all that special about a family owned business in this regard, even though they want you to believe it’s completely different. Family owned is a loose term anyway. Large companies are large companies.

      • the_bear44 minutes ago
        Companies can prioritize things other that money if the shareholders all agree. The more shareholders a company has, the harder it is for them all to agree on anything aside from "we want more money". Family-owned business often (but not always) have a small number of shareholders, so it's easier for them to have shared values.

        For example, my brother and I co-own a smallish (~$5 million/year revenue) software business. We do care about money to some extent, but we regularly agree to do things that work against shareholder value because we also care about things other than money. With two people, it's easy for our values to be aligned on those other things.

        With dozens or more shareholders, that's basically impossible. A publicly traded company couldn't realistically be like "hey shareholders, can we agree that we care a lot about this niche local political issue in the town the company was founded?" The more shareholders you have, the more the only commonality between them is "we want more money".

        There are many family-owned businesses that are only in it for the money, but "family-owned" can be a proxy for "not very many shareholders" which at least opens the door for the company to have non-financial priorities.

        • SoftTalker29 minutes ago
          The existence of "socially conscious" investment funds says that there are investors out there who do value things other than total return. It is a myth that "shareholder value" must only be defined in terms of money. Brand reputation, goodwill, etc. can all be considered. It just happens that money is the overriding concern most of the time.
          • the_bear21 minutes ago
            Sure, if you gather the investors from the start to have a unifying theme other than money, that's fine. But it's very difficult to take a random company with a bunch of unrelated shareholders and convince them all to care about the same thing.

            Even the things you named (brand reputation, goodwill, etc.) are prioritized by companies because they're upstream of shareholder value. Many companies have a float in the Pride parade, an employee volunteer day and post on social media about how they're reducing their carbon footprint. Most of those companies are doing those things because they believe they ultimately increase shareholder value, not because shareholders have decided to sacrifice money because they care more about other things.

      • ericmceran hour ago
        if anything they are even more tight fisted because every penny is theirs.

        publicly traded/vc funded companies have always paid me the most because the money isn’t really theirs.

      • UltraSanean hour ago
        Every family-owned company I've worked for was has been owned by a greedy family.
    • usernomdeguerre43 minutes ago
      Family or not, when these are the executives you hire for over a decade it shouldn't surprise anyone that events like this occur: https://www.ksbw.com/article/taylor-farms-tennessee-ex-presi...

      >Brian Thure served as president of Taylor Farms Tennessee from about 2012 until March 2026 and allegedly used his authority over finances, payroll, vendors and accounting to divert company money for personal benefit. >Taylor Farms claims the alleged fraud came to light during an IRS audit

    • darth_avocadoan hour ago
      It’s a multi billion dollar corporation. It’s not a mom and pop 10 acre farm. Family owned means nothing at that point.
      • siruncledrewan hour ago
        Right. By those stretches, the Sinaloa Cartel and Saudi Aramco could advertise as "family owned"
    • striking2 hours ago
      95% of farms are "family owned". Large scale family owned farms make up about 4% of all farms but 48% of agricultural output. https://www.nass.usda.gov/Publications/Highlights/2025/Censu...

      There's a tendency to want to be nice to farmers who own "family owned farms" because it evokes imagery steeped in quaint classical Americana. It is mostly from misinformation that this impression arises. Don't feel bad for a family owned farm that isn't going well. They get special bankruptcy rules, they can sell off their very valuable land as a backstop, and most of all they are probably not as small and quaint and cute as you think they are.

    • gowldan hour ago
      The WalMart Waltons are a "family"

      At the core, "Family-owned" just means nepotism is preferred over merit.

      (The mob is also "Family-owned")

      • darth_avocadoan hour ago
        SpaceX is more “family owned” than Walmart.
        • saghm37 minutes ago
          That doesn't seem at odds with what they said. The Waltons are a family, which illustrates the point of what a fully "family-owned" business might look like compared to one with external shareholders pretty directly. I don't think it's that hard to understand that giving the Walton's 100% of the stock seems unlikely to address any concerns people have with Walmart, which is evidence of their point that maybe "family-owned" is a red herring.
    • morkalorkan hour ago
      Mary Antoinette should've tried that line "It's not a monarchy, just a family-owned state"
    • ratelimitstevean hour ago
      stockholders? no. stakeholders? absolutely.
  • meroes38 minutes ago
    All I know is the Taylor Farms Creamy Ranch from Costco gave me the worst stomach aches for 4 days and horrible gas
  • pc862 hours ago
    Marketing blogspam by an ambulance chasing attorney who stands to make a lot of money from this if public perception moves a certain way.
    • curuinoran hour ago
      How much of a sin is it for the ambulance-chaser to chase ambulances if the ambulances are there and legitimate? This is what the tort law is for. He's not the one who sprayed feces-water on the lettuce...
    • pixlmintan hour ago
      Started out with "It's not X, it's also Y", followed by an em-dash. I didn't read any further than that.
    • Joel_Mckay34 minutes ago
      Commercial insurance means whatever action they do or don't do is ultimately irrelevant. The supplier will re-brand under another name when things quiet down, proceed to continue selling product, and deduct any capital loss over a year or two.

      Global weather changes means more tropical pests and pathogens are migrating north. People are literally on fire, and shitting their pants in excitement. =3

    • an hour ago
      undefined
    • ratelimitstevean hour ago
      engaging with the identity of the arguer rather than the argument. 5 yard penalty, loss of down.
  • herf2 hours ago
    GPTZero "AI" score for this post: 100%
    • nerdsniperan hour ago
      Why should I put any stock in what some snake oil "AI detector" says?
      • done_lurking32 minutes ago
        It seems plausible that someone could make a decent discriminator for distinguishing human text from AI text. I wouldn't immediately discount the idea.
      • inigyouan hour ago
        You shouldn't. You should instead take note of "it's not X, it's Y" and em-dashes.
        • bigfishrunning23 minutes ago
          You're absolutely right! Those are load-bearing assumptions.
          • nnevatie18 minutes ago
            This is the right shape!
  • t1234s2 hours ago
    I was always under the impression that disease and pesticide don't usually just "wash off" at home.
    • maxlybbertan hour ago
      I remember seeing advice, years ago, to let lettuce sit in a weak bleach solution before use. But I doubt that’s ever been followed by many people. Current advice (at least at home) seems to be to rinse lettuce to remove dirt ( https://hgic.clemson.edu/factsheet/safe-handling-of-lettuce-... ). Apparently most health problems from lettuce are on the surface and not particularly hard to get off.
    • ceejayozan hour ago
      This depends on the food and the disease/pesticide in question.
  • natean hour ago
    "is not marketing. It is evidence". ugh.

    I'm so confused how to feel about these articles. this one is clearly AI written. But blessed by a lawyer so we think the stuff in here is accurate with facts?

    I've accidentally posted an AI article before that seemed just as this was, and the community flagged that to oblivion. Rightfully so I think?

    Does Hacker News need a "report AI" and we can then hide the AI articles as a filter?

    • StilesCrisis14 minutes ago
      This is the Claudiest article I've seen in a long time. "Defensible view." "No correction, no note, no acknowledgment." "The honest statement about X."

      So the next question is, how much of this is true at all, versus just being hallucinations.

  • Simulacraan hour ago
    The lawyers rewrote it four times
  • drivebyhooting2 hours ago
    > A company’s public statement in the middle of an outbreak is not marketing. It is evidence — what the company said it knew, and when, published to the world at a moment when nobody had the benefit of hindsight.

    Stopped reading immediately. If we’re just going to delegate writing to Claude, I won’t bother reading this. And maybe I’ll just delegate my decisions to Claude directly.

    • Barbingan hour ago
      Kept reading and yep there’s more, so it wasn’t just the intro.

      Not quoting it though since someone said they’re ambulance chasers, they’ll have to hire out a smellchecker.

    • pederan hour ago
      This is an obvious next step tho? When I want news, I'll just ask Claude. Everything funnels to these providers?
  • metabagel2 hours ago
    [dead]
  • stronglikedan41 minutes ago
    I see they followed Fauci's Covid playbook. Thank goodness Cyclospora is rarely fatal.