Can you go more into this? I don’t quite follow

It is verbose but inference helps a lot to keep it “tidy”. I always find myself increasing my focus a notch when I start dealing with generics. It’s one of the things I use only if I really “need”.

No.

I kind of want to leave it there. But that will probably be looked on disfavorably.

I've seen at least a dozen attempts. It's not like it's hard to write it out. There's maybe a couple of variants but they're all just a handful of lines. The problem is, once you have an Option in hand, you end up trading:

    val, err := whatever(...)
    if err != nil {
        // handle error
    }
    // use val

for

    val := whatever(...)
    if err, isErr := val.Error(); isErr {
        // handle error
    }
    realVal := val.Value()
    // use realVal

What you win in nominal safety, you're definitely losing in convenience.

There's also no win in trying to offer a monadic interface like

    finalVal := whatever(...).OnVal(func (val Value) opt.Option[Result] {
        // use val
    })

because that's the minimal specification of an anonymous function in Go, so it's very inconvenient. Even if that was trimmed down, nested functions are still problematic in other ways. And you still have to unpack finalVal anyhow.

Really the solution is, install golangci-lint, turn on errcheck [1], use a pre-commit hook to make it a commit failure if golangci-lint fires, and that pretty much covers the problem in practice.

One of the problems with Option/Result/etc. advocacy... not the pattern itself, the advocacy... is that it is generally are presented, implicitly or explicitly, as if the alternative is C, with its errno and the need to not just check an error value, but remember to go actively seeking out errors constantly, making it easy to forget. But by modern standards, that's completely pathological.

If we rate error handling techniques on a scale from 1 to 10 (best), C here is a 1, and standard Option is maybe an 8 or a 9. The way Go does it is maybe a 6; it is completely true that you can neglect to handle an error (see errcheck comment in previous paragraph), but it is in your face that an error is possible, and that's really most of the problem. Putting Option/Result/etc. is not always a "go from 1 to 9" result. "Go from 6 to 8" is a much less impressive proposition, and the other inconveniences that come with it in Go tend to overwhelm the gain. I use errcheck all the time, and even in the Before Times when I was writing it all by hand it really didn't fire all that often. Especially if I exclude test code. In an AI era this hardly rates at all. AI never neglects the error.

Whether it does the right thing with it, now... that's another story entirely.

Read those error handling clauses if you're writing Go with AI. I really don't like what I've seen AIs do with them by default. What I've seen out of AI has been very thoughtless. Nominally correct in some weak sense, but thoughtless.

[1]: https://golangci-lint.run/docs/linters/configuration/#errche...

Tried reading your comment but ran into a lack of usable information.

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(I was on the Go team for ages)

Seriously, that's all it was. Just Ian alone proposed and rejected a half dozen of his own different approaches to generics. Finally a language + implementation plan came together that people all liked.

Nobody was ever opposed to generics that I saw.

If bug free binary search implementation can take 16 years, I am ready to buy generics implementation could take 20 years.

> In his landmark book The Art of Computer Programming, legendary computer scientist Donald Knuth noted that although the first binary search algorithm was published by John Mauchly in 1946, the first bug-free version was not published until 1962—taking a staggering 16 years to get right.

It’s also not true that because it wasn’t part of the initial design that it was harder to retrofit. I just don’t understand all this go bashing that happens on this site especially when so much is badly informed speculation. I guess it’s easier to tear something down.

> what changed in the perspectives of the language maintainers?

The original maintainers moved on to other projects and the new community maintainers came to a consensus through the proposal and governance process.

Unfortunately nothing changed. They wanted generics all along.

The Go ecosystem was a delicate, special thing. It was a wholesale rejection of the malignant consultancy takeover of programming that had festered and spread for the previous 15 years. Introducing generics was a grievous error, and they just keep making it worse.

It used to be you could look at any Go code from any author and pretty much instantly understand it completely. That’s no longer the case.

It used to be you would work on a problem, just writing the code from top to bottom. No time wasted fiddling with abstractions you’ll never use. You’d grumble about it, but succumbing to the temptation was impossible. That’s no longer the case.

and they're still worse than the 1970s state of the art lol

Generics themselves maybe not. Generic methods probably yes. What people want generic methods for is to do deeply nested call chains that were never typical of Go. And if you have deeply nested calls you'll need some way to deal with errors in deeply nested calls, and then a short function syntax to pass to behavior inside those deeply nested calls. Give it a few years and everyone will be writing the same functional slop in Go that they are writing in every other language.

Not here against Generic methods, but I feel the Go team is in a mid-age crisis where they lack of new things to do to prove themselves. See their iterators mini-drama not long ago?

I feel the sumtype/emum/routine demanders should yell a little harder so Go team can find their purpose again.

> generics were a slippery slope. give it a decade and Go will be indistinguishable from c++

Lib boost will have conquered every language by then!!! :D

Jokes aside, generics are unusable in a lot of languages due to their syntax choices. In Go we kinda have the problem that there's no real templating and no real macros, so they're even harder to use.

But I agree somewhat, generics feels to me like an anti pattern in Go.

Also, the way the Go core/stdlib is written, it makes generics so unnecessarily painful to debug. Why they decided to have definitions like "~C" or "~[]S" is beyond me. No human knows what the resulting compile time error means. They should have named these things "Comparable" or "Slicable" or whatever is more expressive. Just stop with this stupid single letter shit.