111 pointsby AndrewDucker3 hours ago17 comments
  • joshkaan hour ago
    I think this belongs on hacker news (and unflagged) mainly because of who Tim Bray is. Notably co-inventor of XML, worked on a bunch of web standards etc. Whether you agree or disagree with non-US citizens coming to America to engage in the advancement of technology, the important thing is actually have discourse on this. That discourse is in line with aims and goals of this site. This is much less politics and much more the impact of social policy on technologists.

    As a non-US citizen myself but who has lived there for some time, I find that having and expressing an opinion like this is difficult to have due to the danger of such retaliation mentioned.

  • LogicFailsMe3 hours ago
    Elections have consequences.
    • GolfPopper2 hours ago
      The election outcome itself was the consequence of gross, systemic failure throughout the entirety of the United States' citizenry, society, institutions, and government.

      The best thing for the States to do at this point would be to hold a Constitutional Convention and dissolve the government of the United States as unfit for any purpose, after which their citizens can decide how they wish to proceed.

      • zuluxa minute ago
        Not an easy idea when about ten states have enough nuclear weapons to glass the earth.
      • 2 hours ago
        undefined
    • gmuslera2 hours ago
      Even not participating in elections have consecuences, at least for proper democratic countries.

      But in countries where participation is mandatory, at least you can say that most of the (national) negatively affected people got what they voted for.

      For improper "democratic" countries where elections are rigged or participation is biased towards some population sectors in a way or another, they are not really elections by the population.

    • jonahbenton2 hours ago
      No, not this story.

      This story is that of Netflix' Chaos Monkey attacking the state most rhetorically aligned/proud of The Rule Of Law and showing in myriad ways how absolutely hollow that pride was and how vulnerable The Law is.

      Are these bugs that get fixed or...if that was The Last Election, maybe not.

    • jmclnx3 hours ago
      yes and the results and actions taken after the Nov 6 US elections may undo some of the damage. But no other country will ever trust the foreign policy of the US no matter what happens.
      • rockskon3 hours ago
        Never say never.

        Germany seems to have recovered quite a lot of trust following World War 2, to provide an extreme example of bad foreign policy.

        • guyzero3 hours ago
          Do you think the US is going to have Nuremberg trials? Do you think there will be a deep national reckoning about what happened?
          • MisterTea2 hours ago
            Never say never.

            > Do you think there will be a deep national reckoning about what happened?

            About half of the people I know who voted for Trump this past election have deep regrets.

        • iamtheworstdev3 hours ago
          they're also on the cusp of throwing it all away, again.
          • HerbManic3 hours ago
            It is wild seeing the elctorial maps of Germany and you can almost exactly recreate the East-West split. Decades later and it is coming back to haunt them.
            • apothegm2 hours ago
              Tbf, the east/west split is the one part that wasn’t the Nazis’ fault unless indirectly as a consequence of starting and losing a second World War in a row.
        • kakacik3 hours ago
          Through selfless deeds, hard work and admitting their failures to the fullest, for generations till now. Somehow I don't see that happening easily with american ego
      • baggachipz3 hours ago
        > yes and the results and actions taken after the Nov 6 US elections may undo some of the damage

        You're assuming that 1) the elections will actually occur on Nov 6, 2) the elections will be fair, and 3) that the winners of said elections would take action and actually enforce the rule of law.

        I'm not confident in any of those.

        • HerbManic3 hours ago
          It will be interesting to see what happens. Many are hoping that there is a very strong turn out for the Democrat's so that any rigging cannot over come it, but this sounds like fan fiction to me. That said Trump hitting Iran may be the single biggest blunder of his political career, media influence can only go so far when there is a direct impact on all prices and potential stock availability in the coming months.

          Hopefully a lot of the fears don't pan out but we won't know until it gets closer.

          I'm not saying that there aren't better options but both major parties are complicit in how the system is organised. The US electoral system gets ever more distorted with every minor adjustment in the hopes of swinging various seats in their favour and now it just looks ridiculous.

      • HerbManic3 hours ago
        There is the military saying "Once is an accident, twice is an attack", this is how a lot of folks see it.

        I think it is deeper, that these actions were taken at the top and a sizable amount of the people sided with them, that sends the message that the US cannot be trusted long term, it has become cultural. I get that it isnt a majority of people but it is big enough that it cannot be ignored.

        • boricj2 hours ago
          "We cannot leave the security of Europe in the hands of voters in Wisconsin every four years."

          Not trusting the Americans was a French thing ever since De Gaulle. It just took the rest of the Europeans 50 years after his death to pick up on it.

          • HerbManic2 hours ago
            That is a brilliant line. And yes Emanuel Macron has been taking this treat seriously as he is very well versed on Da Gaulle.

            He might not have the best domestic moves but when it comes to Geopolitics, he is all over it.

      • dyauspitr3 hours ago
        I don’t think November 6 is going to be a reprieve. They have rigged the system so much that I don’t think it’s actually possible for the Democrats to make a comeback.
        • GolfPopper2 hours ago
          Even if the Democrats do make a comeback, they have spent half a century demonstrating that they are an, at best, an inadequate counter to America's awful political tendencies.
        • billfor3 hours ago
          If they lose it will be because they don’t track unfavorabilty ratings for your democrats as much as they do the current admin. It’s not enough (for moderates) to just say you hate the other guy.
          • dyauspitr2 hours ago
            The thing is a lot of people hate the other guy. It’s just that all this rigging just means they’re going to be disenfranchised.
      • sscaryterry3 hours ago
        This. Once bitten, twice shy
      • throwaway-blaze3 hours ago
        K. Wake me when they have the means to defend themselves. Until then they can distrust the foreign policy of the US but they'll be living with it.
        • smaudet3 hours ago
          Oh, don't worry, the way it's going other countries will be fast motivated to defend themselves from said foreign policy...or perish.
        • EB-BarringtonII3 hours ago
          US protection can be valuable, but US dependence is dangerous.

          The world is moving on.

          • HerbManic3 hours ago
            It is a combination of moving fast and slow. A lot of Canadians now avoid purchasing products from the US were possible. Mean while their government while still dependent on the US is making the moves that will minimise their dependence on them over the coming decades.

            I am seeing similar positions in other countries now.

        • etchalon3 hours ago
          It's absolutely shocking how many people believe other countries lack the means to defend themselves.
    • cyanydeez3 hours ago
      no one thought the consequences would include giving 1.8 billion dollars of American taxes to the people who tried to violently overthrow the government and to those who are successfully leading a bloodless coupe.

      Well, most people, obviously.

    • nba456_3 hours ago
      [flagged]
      • bigyabai3 hours ago
        Then enumerate them.
        • ponkyrisen3 hours ago
          .
          • bigyabai2 hours ago
            But not too scared to import Chinese EVs, apparently. Maybe a trade agreement would be a better coercive tool?
            • 2 hours ago
              undefined
  • jonahbenton2 hours ago
    Can't believe this is flagged. As a USer, it is the letter I would advise anyone outside the US to write. It is the only rational response.

    THIS IS NOT A PLACE OF HONOR.

  • profsummergig3 hours ago
    Serious questions:

    1) I use "socials" anonymously. Have anon accounts on X, IG, FB. If asked to disclose them at the border (am US citizen, but it's happening to them too), do I disclose the anon accounts?

    2) Nothing too controversial in my "socials" (I'm careful), but there's still stuff there that could embarrass me (e.g. mocking or abusing people on X). What would happen if I scrubbed my socials before a trip? Would they be able to find out that I scrubbed, and then construe something about me?

    3) Relatedly, is there a recommended way to scrub one's socials?

    4) Is something like HN considered part of "socials"? I assume Reddit is. So HN must be too? I've had multiple accounts on HN over the years (been serially banned until I stopped leaving controversial comments). What am I expected to do in such an instance? Do I disclose all the HN accounts?

    5) Relatedly, I have multiple X accounts (squatting on usernames). Do I disclose all the accounts?

    • stop502 hours ago
      1. If you don't and they find out, then you committed an felony. It is the same as the "Are you an terrorist?" questions. Once they want you for more serious stuff like blasphemy against king donald, then they can pull out the convicted felon card and increase the sentence.

      2. + 4. It depends

      3. If you plan to go to the us while Trump and his chronies are in an position of power, then the best way to scrub them is not to post it.

      5. See 1. if you don't disclose all, they can pull the lie on a form card

    • jamie_ca2 hours ago
      My understanding is (1) yes. (2) maybe, maybe no, depends on if they're looking up people tagging you in threads? If there's signs you're scrubbing yourself out of politically controversial threads that might become problematic. (4) yes, yes, yes. (5) yes.

      Assuming they do ask in the first place.

  • 3 hours ago
    undefined
  • yearesadpeople3 hours ago
    It would appear rage has well and truly been bated. My word.
    • HerbManic2 hours ago
      Yeah I usually expect better of the comments here but it looks like a nerve has been hit.
    • breve2 hours ago
      Bated means the opposite of what you mean.
  • gortok3 hours ago
    The comments on this HN post nicely color the problem Tim points out, from the comments that assume the exceptionalism of the USA, to comments that say “stay in Canada”, to comments that call the post “moral preening”.

    I grew up in a very conservative household, and until the tea party/Trumpian alliance would have called myself a small-l libertarian.

    Now? I won’t vote republican for a whole host of reasons, not the least of which is that it rhymes with the worst parts of the political parties we destroyed in world wars.

    There’s something new almost every day that should, in a sane culture, cause folks to abandon the Republican Party en masse. Today’s example? The 1.776 Billion “anti-weaponization” fund that is a slush fund for Trump and his allies, including folks that stormed the Capitol on January 6, 2021. The grift of this administration is shocking, but the fact that rank-and-file conservatives aren’t abandoning it by the millions gives away the game. It isn’t about principles, it’s about one party winning, no matter what.

    We used to fight for what’s right, but we have become the villain. Tim is right about the declination of America (realizing his title is a double-entendre), and I can’t help but wonder if there is even a line that Trump could cross to the modern “Republican” party.

    • WarOnPrivacy2 hours ago
      > I won’t vote republican for a whole host of reasons, not the least of which is that it rhymes with the worst parts of the political parties we destroyed in world wars.

      As a former right winger, now recovering conservative, I'm inclined to agree. The greater issue for me is the right became every single thing they accused the left of (being easily hurt, mandated viewpoints, group think).

      It's all the natural progression of the animosity campaigns Newt Gingrich launched a generation ago. ref: https://www.thisamericanlife.org/662/where-there-is-a-will/a...

    • HerbManic2 hours ago
      I said in another response, Trump has shown the cards to world that there is a sizable portion of the country that can not be trusted. Other nations have realised this is an embedded problem and cannot be fixed with another election. At least not on a long scale.
    • ponkyrisen2 hours ago
      [flagged]
      • Sabinus2 hours ago
        Use your main account. Go on.
  • L-boog3 hours ago
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  • kesor3 hours ago
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  • ravenstine3 hours ago
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  • throwawaypath3 hours ago
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  • ronnier3 hours ago
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  • Felger3 hours ago
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    • siliconc0w3 hours ago
      EU equities outperformed US in 2025. The Iran war will probably shift this back to the US but launching a new poorly defined war (and arguably losing it) is also a pretty good indicator of decline.
  • smileson23 hours ago
    [flagged]
  • ArchieScrivener3 hours ago
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  • throwaway-blaze3 hours ago
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    • nchmy3 hours ago
      People - Canadians included - have literally been sent to a gulag at the border crossing, for social media posts and otherwise. Can you really not see why that would cause someone to not want to enter?

      Moreover, he literally said he continues to be a supporter of that org.

      • fylo3 hours ago
        I believe the UK is doing a similar thing with regards to social media posts.
        • bediger40003 hours ago
          How is that relevant? He wasn't invited to an unconference in the UK.
      • kesor3 hours ago
        People have been sent to the gulag by the Canadian government as well, not too long ago. Governments are disgusting.
        • HerbManic2 hours ago
          Terrance McKenna once said something like "The worst government is the one in power, regardless of the time."

          Essentially, regardless of who is in, they rarely teardown the injustices of the past but merely build on them. They will rip out like 20% of things that are socially changing but after that it is a ratchet upwards on things that cement in further power.

        • nchmy2 hours ago
          Have a link to share about it?
      • throwawaypath3 hours ago
        >for social media posts

        That was fake news, didn't happen.

    • andyjohnson03 hours ago
      > "I won't engage with interesting people in a country whose leadership I don't like"

      I dont know where you got that quote from, but it doesnt occur in the submitted blog post.

      It seems to me that the important actual quote is:

      "I’m Canadian and as a matter of principle feeling negative about visiting a neighboring country whose leader has repeatedly threatened our sovereignty and shown massive disrespect for our nationhood."

      I live in Europe and I agree with the author's misgivings.

    • Underphil3 hours ago
      Whether it would happen or not is immaterial. The perceived threat is enough. I've been here on a green card since 2016 and haven't left the country since his second term since I share the exact same fears.
    • dsr_3 hours ago
      Don't be ridiculous. The US operates gulags in other countries, so that they don't have to pretend to follow our own laws.
    • cdrnsf3 hours ago
      People have already been harassed for social media posts and citizens have been murdered in broad daylight simply for observing law enforcement.
    • simonw3 hours ago
      > Also love he thinks his social media posts will cause him to be sent to a gulag at the border crossing.

      https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/News/visas-news/a...

      > Effective March 30, the Department of State will expand online presence review to include applicants in the following additional nonimmigrant visa classifications [...] To facilitate this vetting, all applicants for A-3, C-3 (if a domestic worker), G-5, H-3, H-4 dependents of H-3, K-1, K-2, K-3, Q, R-1, R-2, S, T, U, H-1B, H-4, F, M, and J nonimmigrant visas are instructed to adjust the privacy settings on all of their social media profiles to “public” or “open.”

      https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/mar/19/trump-musk-f...

      > A French scientist was denied entry to the US this month after immigration officers at an airport searched his phone and found messages in which he had expressed criticism of the Trump administration, said a French minister. [...]

      > The same source said that messages discussing the Trump administration’s treatment of scientists had been found. The researcher was reportedly then accused of writings “that reflect hatred toward Trump and can be described as terrorism”.

      https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2025/jun/15/austr...

      > An Australian man who was detained upon arrival at Los Angeles airport and deported back to Melbourne says United States border officials told him it was due to his writing on pro-Palestine protests by university students.

      • throwawaypath3 hours ago
        >A French scientist was denied entry to the US this month after immigration officers at an airport searched his phone and found messages in which he had expressed criticism of the Trump administration

        That was fake news.

        “The French researcher in question was in possession of confidential information on his electronic device from Los Alamos National Laboratory — in violation of a nondisclosure agreement — something he admitted to taking without permission and attempted to conceal,”

        https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/21/world/europe/us-france-sc...

        • etchalon2 hours ago
          The only evidence we have it was fake news is a statement from the Department of Homeland Security itself - a department which has been repeatedly caught lying in courts of law under this administration.

          But I'm sure the statement they gave to a journalist, which hasn't been confirmed by any third-party reporting, was absolutely factual.

          • throwawaypathan hour ago
            The only evidence we have it was real news is a statement from scientists - which have been repeatedly caught lying in courts of law under this administration.

            But I'm sure the statement they gave to a journalist, which hasn't been confirmed by any third-party reporting, was absolutely factual.

            • etchalonan hour ago
              I think you think that was clever.
              • throwawaypathan hour ago
                You thinking that I think that was clever is telling.
    • etchalon3 hours ago
      Plenty of people have had their social media posts result in extended detention by our border security.
  • fuddle3 hours ago
    TIL a new word - "boosterism"