121 pointsby ranit9 hours ago13 comments
  • niemandhier2 minutes ago
    “Arboreal sexism” is a similar phenomenon:

    We prefer male trees in cities since they do not produce fruit that drop on the streets. The result is a much higher pollen load.

  • flohofwoe2 hours ago
    Hmm, most German forests are also vast monoculture 'tree farms' and have been for the last 250 years (also caused by large scale deforestation in the centuries before). In the Ore Mountains we also have those yellow clouds of pollen coming off spruce trees every few years, covering everything with a thin yellow dust layer, yet I'm not aware that the number of people with pollen allergies is exceptionally high (oth, maybe it was 200 years ago and by now the population has become immune, or maybe the tree pollen in Japan is just more aggressive...).
    • efesak2 hours ago
      The spruce and other local conifers (I live by the Bohemian Forest/Bayerischer Wald) have pollen that seems to be low allergenic by design. I know a lot of people who are allergic to birch or weed pollen, but not to spruce.
    • idiomaddict2 hours ago
      I moved to Germany as an adult from a completely separate biome, and I’ve got terrible problems with allergies I never had in my home country
      • thrownthatway6 minutes ago
        > from a completely separate biome

        You were off planet‽

    • soni96pl19 minutes ago
      My aunt in Poland has terrible allergies now because of yellow pollen from spruce, but I'm not sure how that translates to larger population, other than it does happen
      • jeltz9 minutes ago
        Spruce allergy is a thing but it is rare. Only a few unlucky people suffer from it.
    • INTPenisan hour ago
      Pollen allergies have definitely skyrocketed in Sweden. We used to be able to sit in an office and work all year without hearing people sniffle and sneeze.

      Now it's like an epidemic, at least half the office is affected.

      • reeredfdfdfan hour ago
        Probably we can blame higher hygiene standards, or some other environmental factor for it. Forests haven't changed much in past decades.

        Here in Finland I've never been affected by any kind of tree pollen at all, but somehow timothy grass pollen gives me horrible symptoms, forcing me to take antihistamine most of the summer. I lived my childhood near farmland and forests, so definitely got exposed to both forms of pollen at early age.

        • skirgean hour ago
          food is full of histamine, especially fish and fermented food which is considered healthy but some (MCAS, HIT) people are sensitive.
    • alphabeta3r562 hours ago
      Germany has half the percentage of forest as Japan
    • postepowanieadm2 hours ago
      Spruce is also a problem in Poland, especially southern. Leaf trees have been replaced with "fast growing" spruce over a hundred years ago.
    • iLoveOncall2 hours ago
      Hayfever allergy rates are growing around the whole world, Germany included.
    • Xmd5aan hour ago
      "why do you sneeze, we don't do that Germany"
  • hastily31143 hours ago
    Interesting. I noticed that many people have hay fever in Japan, but I always just assumed it was genetic or something. I wonder if living there for a long time will make you more sensitive to pollen
    • timr3 hours ago
      As someone who has suffered from hay fever for my entire life, and also lived in many different locations, almost every move came with a 2-3 year reprieve from my symptoms while my body "discovered" the fun new local allergens.
    • mathieuhan hour ago
      It’s known that repeated exposure to allergens can cause allergic symptoms in people previously without them. For example https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bird_fancier%27s_lung https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farmer%27s_lung

      I actually seemed to grow out of hay fever when I was in my early 20s. Perhaps coincidentally this is also around the time I developed an allergy to cannabis from overuse. Wonder if they’re related somehow.

    • mc33013 hours ago
      Lots of people I know who moved here as adults have developed pollen allergies over the years. Some after a 2 or 3 years, some after 10.
    • tidenly2 hours ago
      I got hayfever on my 3rd year of living here, and it seems like quite a common pattern among immigrants I've noticed. I have hayfever back in the UK too, but I guess I didn't have a Cedar allergy - so it took time to develop.
    • 3 hours ago
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    • komali23 hours ago
      I'd been wondering why my allergies go nuts every time I visit Japan, but never really suffered in other Asian countries. Cool to know now.

      Upside is I discovered the trick of just taking fexofenadine every single day which had the side effect of solving my chronic sinus infections.

      • petesergeant2 hours ago
        My quality of life is notably better from daily fexofenadine vs what I think was low-level allergies that I developed in my 20s to pets, dust, etc
    • Markoff2 hours ago
      I would assume it has more to do with less exposition to hay/pollen in urban areas, for instance in years in Beijing I've had hardly allergies since it is not exactly green, though I went to parks, but here in Prague right now with everything blooming it's nuts.

      Actually now that I think about it never head really problems with allergies even in Southeast Asia, though I was in very green areas, maybe humidity helps as well?

      • tpm6 minutes ago
        I think the humidity has to play a role in that. Very dry air is not good for the nose even without allergies. This year the spring is very dry and also quite cold in Central Europe which makes things worse.
    • plutokras3 hours ago
      [flagged]
  • dv_dt2 hours ago
    Hmm, I'm also wondering about studies about overly sanitized environments for children being correlated with higher allergy rates.

    I guess poking around for a good representative study, it's actually low diversity of microbial exposure, not "cleaning" per-se that is correlated - e.g this is one reason why households with dogs have lower allergy rates. A monoculture of certain tree species also implies less microbial diversity.

    • Terr_an hour ago
      I'd like to preemptively draw a line between two different kinds of hypothesis when it comes to hygiene:

      1. The immune system is not being exposed enough to wild or even infectious content, and it needs more threats to fight off.

      2. ("Old Friends") The immune system is not being exposed enough to commensal or even symbiotic organisms that we co-evolved with, throwing off its calibration and tuning.

      I instinctively prefer the second, the first seems a little too simple, like some some scaled-down version of "tough love" and "spare the rod[-bacteria], spoil the child."

    • DANmode2 hours ago
      It can go the other direction, too: exposure to moldy home environments gave me (now resolved) food sensitivities, dust allergies, pet-associated allergies, etc.

      You can definitely undertrain, or overwhelm, the immune system if not cautious!

  • pjc503 hours ago
    Japan being 68% forest is an astounding stat.
    • vkou3 hours ago
      75% of it is mountains, and not exactly inhabited.
      • Schlagbohrer2 hours ago
        The nation has also had declining population (hence deflationary housing) for years
    • Markoff2 hours ago
      Still behind Finland (73.7%) and Sweden (68.7%) though and Laos (71.6%) as well.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_forest_ar...

      • Y-bar7 minutes ago
        I don’t consider that a good Wikipedia article because it does a bad job distinguishing between natural forests and mono-/bicultural plantations of which there are vast areas of here. It’s quite like calling wheat fields ”grasslands”. Both fundamentally lack biodiversity.
    • sandworm101an hour ago
      Not really for a mountain island. Being near the coast means increased moisture and wind, which hits mountains to make rain. Take a japanese-sized slice off the coast of most countries and you will find lots of forrest. Think the pacific northwest, or the bits of hawaii not covered in lava. Then compare parts of the australian coast with no mountains.
    • sl-112 minutes ago
      Would not count it as forest, but plantation, if it is heavily managed.
  • OutOfHerean hour ago
    Doesn't pollen also have to do with the "gender" of the trees? In gendered trees, male trees emit pollen and female trees intercept pollen.

    Not all species of trees are gendered (dioecious) but various are. If reforestation used male trees at the expense of female, then pollen count will be higher.

    Urban developers who made the mistake of using male trees, because they don't drop fruit/berries/seed pods, will make the residents suffer pollen.

    Sugi and hinoki are apparently not gendered -- they're monoecious.

  • closetkantian2 hours ago
    I first read about this in The Emptiness of Japanese Affluence by Gavin McCormick. Really good read.
    • cyberpunk26 minutes ago
      wow 170 euros on amazon.de :/
  • rimworldan hour ago
    estimated 43% of the population --wow
  • 3 hours ago
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  • xchipan hour ago
    This article could have been summarized in three paragraphs.

    I'm really hating this trend of diluting content by giving useless testimonials, random anecdotes and delaying the resolution of the subject as much as possible.

    • edent10 minutes ago
      People like reading.

      You could summarise all of Ender's Game in a couple of sentences but, guess what, that wouldn't be particularly pleasurable.

      Not everything has to by hyper-efficient. More importantly, not everything has to be tailored specifically for you. It's OK that other people like reading long-form content.

  • lloydatkinson3 hours ago
    Only two types of tree? Even in the 1970's surely that should have been cause for concern.
    • Mashimo3 hours ago
      This might have something to do with it:

      > When the sugi and hinoki forests were first planted in the 1950s and 60s, they weren't meant to stand forever. At the time, it was assumed they would be gradually cut down and replanted over time, as had been the case before the war. But as Japan's economy boomed in the late 60s and 70s, major cities like Kobe and Tokyo grew rapidly, and it ended up being cheaper to import wood from other countries such as Malaysia and Indonesia.

      • thaumasiotes2 hours ago
        I don't get the relevance of "major cities grew rapidly". That can only mean that demand for wood spiked. There's no way it can cause local wood to become less competitive with imported wood.
        • freehorsean hour ago
          It sounds contradictory but it often does. When a part of the economy booms, it may make other parts of the economy less able to keep up because they cannot increase profitability at the same pace (so people will seek jobs with larger salaries, or investments will go different ways). Moreover, increase of demand can drive seeking cheaper sources of a product, which then overtakes the previous ones due to being cheaper (while before this increase due to regulations or lack of certain network/supply chain it may not have been possible or profitable enough to seek these sources).
        • martin_a2 hours ago
          > There's no way it can cause local wood to become less competitive with imported wood.

          But isn't that what we're seeing around the world? Be it cheaper labor, political control or whatever else, imported goods can be cheaper than locally produced goods.

        • niemandhier2 hours ago
          It does: Cheap rural workers could get better paying jobs in the cities so wages increased in rural areas to
        • ZiiS2 hours ago
          It required imported wood come what may, which opened up regulations and economies of scale that would have made importing wood expensive.
  • aaron6953 hours ago
    [dead]
  • youre-wrong32 hours ago
    > which is already arriving earlier in Japan due to climate change

    They couldn’t help but put in ideological bs.

    • jplrssn2 hours ago
      I’ll bite: which ideology are you claiming believers in climate change are motivated by?