164 pointsby Jayschwa4 hours ago12 comments
  • whobrea minute ago
    Love it! Now, let's port it to CP/M (via GSX, maybe?)
  • ronsor3 hours ago
    All that's left now is SDL for UEFI, and then all our games can run in a pre-OS environment.
    • mananaysiemprean hour ago
      That... Shouldn’t be terribly difficult? Though I don’t believe UEFI has sound drivers (you’ll have problems writing one yourself because even frickin’ sound-codec chips have NDA-only datasheets these days), and the stupidest thing is that the “graphics output protocol” doesn’t indicate vsync so you can’t do tear-free blitting, which is literally worse than VGA.
    • BirAdam2 hours ago
      Well… UEFI is kind of modern DOS.
      • lnx01an hour ago
        It certainly is not.
    • chaps3 hours ago
      That honestly sounds amazing. Imagine booting into something like a grub menu that's just a list of classic games.
      • Xirdus3 hours ago
        I basically had this setup back in the day. I don't really know how I ended up with it, I was 7 at the time and none of it was intentional - but my bootloader had two entries: I could boot into Windows 98, or I could boot into Worms.
        • Dwedit2 hours ago
          It's a similar idea, but that's a DOS menu. At the point when the menu appears, MS-DOS 7.1 has already been loaded.
        • dale_glass2 hours ago
          Probably your parents setting it up?

          As far as I know, Worms is a normal DOS game, so the only way for that to happen should be a DOS install configured to just auto-start Worms on boot. Which makes sense as a way to keep a kid away from anything that could cause trouble.

          I very vaguely recall that there used to be a very few PC games that worked as boot floppies and possibly didn't use DOS at all, but it was a rarity and Worms definitely wasn't one.

          • Induane2 hours ago
            I bet it wasn't actually the bootloader but something with autoexec.bat - you could setup choices in it and windows was just one launch option.
            • Xirdus2 hours ago
              Well, if you treat DOS as a bootloader for Windows 98 - which it was actually - then modifying autoexec.bat would count as setting up the bootloader.
          • Xirdus2 hours ago
            No, I set it up. My parents were non-technical. I had a CD-ROM re-release of Worms for DOS from one gaming magazine or another. I guess the installer set it up somewhere somehow but I remember it wasn't easy to get it installed and there were further problems trying to launch it. It's possible the installer itself was a DOS program, not a Windows program.
      • ButlerianJihad41 minutes ago
        Imagine trying to play "Global Thermonuclear War", but the author put it behind a confirmation dialog!
      • queuebert3 hours ago
        I would guess a modern BIOS chip is as powerful as an NES, right?
        • snazz3 hours ago
          You can do substantially more in UEFI than NES-level games. (See https://uefi.org/specs/UEFI/2.9_A/12_Protocols_Console_Suppo...)
        • fluoridation3 hours ago
          What do you mean by "BIOS chip"? Like, the flash memory that stores the motherboard's firmware? I don't think that contains any processing elements.
          • sedatk3 hours ago
            BIOS can only manage VESA which is much much slower than the capabilities of a modern GPU, so they might have meant graphical performance in regards to that.
    • pjmlpan hour ago
      Welcome to Amiga games, in many cases the floppy would contain the boot loader that would directly jump into the game.

      At least on the Amiga 500 you would not go through the trouble to start Workbench, only to load the game, unless you were a lucky owner of an external hard drive.

      • markus_zhangan hour ago
        I recall many IBM-PC games are bootable games. I inserted a floppy , resets the computer, and then it directly boots into the game. The disk must contain a boot sector and drivers and such.
  • alnwlsn3 hours ago
    This is an especially funny screenshot as DosBOX itself is built on SDL.
  • vunderba3 hours ago
    Awesome. I wonder how this would work with a 386+ targeted MS-DOS executable from FreeBASIC, which supports binding to SDL.

    [1] - https://github.com/freebasic/fbc

  • jlokier2 hours ago
    Perfect! I was just doing some Turbo C development inside DOSBox-X inside Debian GNU/Linux inside VMware Fusion inside macOS this morning.
    • vodouan hour ago
      Was this a joke? I must know!
    • bpavuk2 hours ago
      you may also enjoy watching Inception then :)
      • psychoslave14 minutes ago
        Almost but usually I watch live stream of people watching records of people talking about how they remember about it.
  • looneysquashan hour ago
    For a open source project like SDL is, for something like this, it's usually a matter of how invasive it is, and how likely the contributors seem to stick around and maintain it.

    Different projects have different policies, and I don't know what SDLs is.

    But they already have a lot of ports, so I trust they know what they're getting themselves into.

  • vintermannan hour ago
    SDL getting back to its Loki roots
  • Dwedit3 hours ago
    Technically this already worked with HXDOS, which emulated DirectDraw well enough that SDL could use it.
  • shevy-java2 hours ago
    Good - now we can play more DOS games again!
  • raverbashing3 hours ago
    Well I guess Allegra was a bit old already /s
    • sedatk2 hours ago
      I loved Allegra! Saved me a lot of time when I was writing code for our musicdisk. That was 29 years ago though. :)
  • jan_Sate3 hours ago
    Uhm... excuse me? Why? Is there anyone even using DOS for anything serious these days?
    • mrweasel2 hours ago
      Perhaps not serious, but I think people gravitate towards older systems these days because they are easier to conceptualize. It's not unrealistic for a single person to have a complete grasp of e.g. the C64 and it's programming environment. DOS is similarly constraint, but also easier for you to form a more or less complete mental model around.

      Some people love computers and making them do weird stuff, older computers make certain tasks feel more manageable.

    • sedatk3 hours ago
      Most computers in Turkey come with FreeDOS preinstalled because there's a law that states all computers must be sold with an operating system. FreeDOS turns out to be the cheapest and easiest.

      That's why you don't let people who have never touched a computer write tech laws. You get results like this.

      • unleaded2 hours ago
        Those types of laws aren't all that bad.. they got us this: https://segaretro.org/Dottori_Kun
      • Dwedit3 hours ago
        The really weird case is where the computer isn't actually compatible with DOS, so they put in a locked-down Linux distro that emulates FreeDOS.
        • ronsor3 hours ago
          Wasn't it Dell or HP that did this? IIRC it was FreeDOS-on-QEMU-on-X11-on-Linux.
      • wk_end3 hours ago
        Is there a reason they don't go with Ubuntu or something like that instead?
        • jordandan hour ago
          Linux drivers and certification is a whole lot of extra work and complexity compared to FreeDOS. Years ago, Nettops were sold with FreeDOS where the components didn't support Linux that well.
        • prmoustache3 hours ago
          I guess they don't want to get support's call. DOS looks like firmware for non techies.
    • wk_end3 hours ago
      Who said anything about "serious"?

      (FWIW: I suspect there are more than a few old industrial control systems and such out there that are still running DOS, just because of an "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" attitude)

      • kjs32 hours ago
        My brother is in manufacturing. DOS is everywhere. Older things too (PDP-11? DG Nova? Seen both, semi-recently). Not just because "ain't broke, don't fix", but because when you have a cloth dying machine or brick forming machine you spent >US$5M for, that is often a bespoke install for your plant, you don't replace it because some guy who prolly slings Javascript all day sez "DOS is oooold, boomer".
    • kjs32 hours ago
      Because it's fun, at least for certain folks? Crazy, right?
    • mikepurvis3 hours ago
      Hacker News
    • gbin3 hours ago
      The real question is "why not?" :)
      • spijdar3 hours ago
        I think this PR is awesome, and I can totally see myself playing around with this at some point. Being able to create DOS executables of SDL projects is just ... cool!

        But I do wonder about the practicality. This would, I presume (never done DOS development, never touched a memory extender) only run on 386+ CPUs, and maybe more importantly, probably require a newer CPU than that to run anything non-trivial at acceptable performance. So I wonder how many "real DOS machines" this can practically target.

        Still, it is massively cool.

    • jordand2 hours ago
      There's a lot of interesting projects and even innovation going on making new games for old PCs/consoles. James Lambert and Kaze are doing fantastic work in the N64 space as one example (watch their videos on Youtube)
    • queuebert3 hours ago
      There used to be stock exchanges running happily on DOS. Maybe there still are.
      • chaps3 hours ago
        Worked at an exchange in 2007/2008 and... we had systems still running from the 80s. Mostly tape audit stuff.
      • BirAdam2 hours ago
        Most use Linux now, and specifically RHEL. I did see some IBM z, but that was specifically for one old DB that handled oil pipeline stuff.
    • benatkin2 hours ago
      SDL is written in C. So it can support it without too much trouble. And some people are compiling stuff to run on DOS. So it makes sense. And your objection doesn't hold any water.
    • alnwlsn3 hours ago
      because you can
    • reaperduceran hour ago
      Uhm... excuse me? Why? Is there anyone even using DOS for anything serious these days?

      Translation: "Stop liking things I don't like!"

      • spankibaltan hour ago
        I suppose it's an issue of ignorance; even IT veterans often don't know that DOS was, and still is, the driver of many highly specialized industry applications, or an OS running the software of individuals as well as small business owners around the world.
  • 3 hours ago
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