EV sales soar in main European markets as drivers shun expensive petrol(www.reuters.com)
36 pointsby akyuu7 hours ago6 comments
  • jqpabc1237 hours ago
    The big winner from the Iran war thus far --- China.

    Whether Israel is a real winner is yet to be determined.

    There is no significant, strategic benefit to the USA despite spending at least $50 billion thus far --- not counting the cost of inflated fuel prices.

    • Symbiote5 hours ago
      > Last week the German automotive trade body said restructuring in the industry and new investment was paying off, as every second electric car sold in Europe was now made in Germany.

      https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2026/apr/20/electric...

    • whatevaa4 hours ago
      China has been winning since Trump took office second time. They are winning by doing... nothing :)
      • slaw3 hours ago
        China is advancing for the last 25 years, Trump or no Trump.
    • kylehotchkiss5 hours ago
      Well, we stopped hearing about the files. That's kinda a benefit to some people?
  • a_shovel4 hours ago
    The next administration needs to mandate the big American auto companies produce more EVs in more models in order to save them from the irrelevance they seemingly desire and arguably deserve.
    • melling3 hours ago
      You’re part of the problem, not the solution. There’s an entire political backlash against EVs because of mandates. The Trump Administration actually prevented California from having EV quotas.

      Simply let in EVs from China and let American car companies go out of business.

      • smithocan hour ago
        There's a political backlash because Fox News and some Russian propaganda social media accounts told people to get angry and they did.

        We have mandates against leaded fuel and excessively tinted windows and for child seats. We have mandates for airbags and seatbelts and bumper heights and crumple zones and turn signals.

        EVs are better than gas cars in every way - less noise, less pollution, less dependency buying oil from the Middle East. Our policies, regulations and incentive structures should mirror that.

        • mellingan hour ago
          If they’re better, you don’t need mandates.
      • a_shovel2 hours ago
        There's a political backlash against vaccines because of mandates too, and I think we shouldn't listen to them either.
  • ManuelKiessling3 hours ago
    I say this as someone who owns two EV cars, zero ICE cars, and loves everything about owning and driving EVs: it baffles me how quickly and noticeably consumers shift their preferences; I think I read something along the lines of „for the average German commuter, the petrol price spike means 6 euros plus per week in spending“ — and that is enough for so many people to go „okay screw it I’m switching to new technology for my planned purchase“?

    I mean, great that it happens, but yeah, I‘m baffled.

    • izacus2 hours ago
      The second part is the fact that domestic brands all came out with good EVs and many people are installing home solar which makes savings even more drastic.
    • bamboozled2 hours ago
      It’s the stress around it, not the current price. That’s what people are replacing.

      If I’m trying to plan for the future in a world where conflicts this destructive are permanently on the menu, I’m not going to ever buy an ICE car again. No one wants to be at the mercy of anyone else where possible and as someone who only owns ICE cars, it’s been very stressful few weeks.

      • ManuelKiessling2 hours ago
        I think you are on to something here. But it would mean that sentiment could change on a whim: a serious blackout somewhere in Europe that makes continent-wide headlines, and EV demand might crash.
    • rsynnott2 hours ago
      I mean, realistically it's only going one direction.
  • jesterson6 hours ago
    I wonder what way of thinking these people exercise. They think electricity prices are somehow shielded from price going up?
    • barbazoo4 hours ago
      ICE cars use energy from close to 100% oil. As long as your electrical grid is more diverse than that, you're already better off.
      • 0cf8612b2e1e4 hours ago
        Exactly, electricity generation is already diversified, so it naturally gets somewhat shielded from shocks. Energy companies can burn wood if they get truly desperate, but I can only fill up my car with gasoline.
      • peterlada4 hours ago
        What? Where? In face that statement is not true pretty much everywhere. 50% of electricity in Hungary is nuclear. 80% in France. 50% coal in Poland, 30 % solar in Spain.
        • supercheetah4 hours ago
          You should reread their post. You're proving their point.
    • triceratops5 hours ago
      In places where electricity generation is primarily nuclear, solar, hydro, wind, or geothermal? Yeah pretty much.

      In most countries electric utilities have either regulated rates or are public-owned. They don't increase prices willy-nilly.

      • ZeroGravitas5 hours ago
        If you have an internet connected charger, which is standard in some countries, you can be decoupled from gas prices long before the gas gets phased out of the grid by charging when the grid is cheap and clean, even if gas is still being used for peakers. A simple timer will also often do the job, but you get even lower prices if you help the grid out by letting it dictate the exact time to start charging.
    • codeduck4 hours ago
      It's not about price; it's hedging against the very real risk of petrol rationing and shortages. An EV can charge from any source, and in Europe a lot of power is sourced from non-oil sources
    • rsynnott2 hours ago
      Very few electricity grids (I think _none_ in Europe?) are particularly dependent on oil. Many European grids are quite _gas_ dependent, but gas prices are considerably less volatile than oil.
    • thebruce87m3 hours ago
      Here’s my way of thinking: charging overnight on a smart tariff means my cost per mile is a quarter of what it used to be. It could go up by 3x and I’d still save.
    • whatevaa4 hours ago
      No. But there is more control than with petrol. An if you have more charger, could balance charginf during off-peak cheaper hours.

      Can't do anything about petrol. Pay or gtfo.

    • jjtheblunt3 hours ago
      i rarely (as a 12 year ev driver) see discussions mention you just get multiple times more distance per dollar, as a consumer, with an EV over ICE. (and i like both....it's just what i have measured having both)
    • IshKebab2 hours ago
      Don't accuse people of not thinking before you've thought about it.

      Charging an electric car at home is a lot cheaper than filling an ICE car with petrol. If the price of both doubles you save more money by switching to electric.

      To make it really simple...

      Before: Petrol car costs £10k to buy, plus 20p/mile (or whatever). Electric car costs £20k, plus 5p/mile.

      After: Petrol car costs 40p/mile. Electric car costs 10p/mile.

      That pushes the incentive towards electric.

  • johnwhitman3 hours ago
    [dead]
  • measurablefunc7 hours ago
    These are just flashes in a pan. The material math for EVs is not viable.
    • jqpabc1237 hours ago
      I'll bet your math conveniently ignores the fact that the supply of petroleum is inherently limited and subject to disruption for political and other "non-material" reasons..
      • measurablefunc5 hours ago
        It's not a political statement, just basic physics & chemistry: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEkIh2PcSYE
        • diablozzq5 hours ago
          Your own YouTube link refutes your conclusion. in the first few sentences he states “The problem is not with EVs it’s with mandates”

          EVs are fine,

          yes they are still limited in some cases.

          • measurablefunc5 hours ago
            The mandates won't fix the fundamental physical & material problems so I'll repeat what I said. EVs are never going to work at the scale of ICEs, the numbers don't work out. Regardless of any political "incentives", there is only a finite amount of copper & only finitely many cars that can be made w/ that amount of copper which has to be extracted & processed using non-renewable resources.
            • barbazoo5 hours ago
              > Regardless of any political "incentives", there is only a finite amount of copper & only finitely many cars that can be made w/ that amount of copper which has to be extracted & processed using non-renewable resources.

              > the numbers don't work out

              What are the numbers? Are we running out of any of those? Are we not recycling enough materials?

            • wao0uuno4 hours ago
              Copper is a widely recycled metal. Is there not enough copper on earth to replace all ICE cars with EVs? Can you post some sources? And those numbers you keep talking about so I can verify if your calculator is working alright.
              • measurablefunc3 hours ago
                I already posted the link. You are welcome to verify the details for yourself by following up on what you take to be articles of faith. The burden of proof is on you to explain why the numbers actually work.
                • torvoborvo2 hours ago
                  You act like no one has ever seen propaganda before. An extraordinary claim that all of society neglected some simple math, (even at significant personal investment losses in many cases) needs a bit more than one video.
                • vel0city2 hours ago
                  Your link is an oil industry shill saying asinine things like EVs are too expensive because they have welds in their manufacturing processes.

                  Mark Mills is the founder of The National Center for Energy Analytics. Where do they get their funding? Groups like the Texas Public Policy Foundation. Where do they get their funding? That's right, billionaire oilmen.

                  https://www.texasobserver.org/revealed-the-corporations-and-...

                  Dude is paid to throw out falsehoods and sow doubt and confusion on behalf of oil industry billionaires.

                  > The burden of proof is on you to explain why the numbers actually work

                  The burden of proof is on you to share actual data of your claims there's not enough copper for EVs not ramblings of paid liars on a YouTube video.

                  > following up on what you take to be articles of faith

                  Hilarious you're suggesting him asking for actual data is him relying on blind articles of faith while your video is just a man rambling without any actual hard facts in a video, saying lots of things that just on their face make little sense.

                  • measurablefunc2 hours ago
                    You've convinced me, the data you have presented definitely makes it clear & obvious that Mark Mills is wrong & you are right.
                    • vel0city2 hours ago
                      But this guy says 9 out of 10 doctors prefer Camels!

                      Mark Mills is essentially the same as those researchers who told you cigarettes don't cause cancer and lead in the gas isn't anything to worry about.

                      • measurablefunc2 hours ago
                        I didn't really ask for analogies & metaphors but you spent a lot of time not doing any of the math. It's a good thing I found your argument convincing though, now everyone else can look at this thread & convince themselves that EVs are viable b/c you presented very coherent evidence & arguments.
                        • vel0city2 hours ago
                          > but you spent a lot of time not doing any of the math

                          I actually did the math two hours ago in the other comment showing your point about copper is nonsensical.

                          Strange the oil man is so concerned about a recycleable metal that an EV uses 200lbs or less of compared to the 48,000lbs a similar ICE will burn in gas. Doesn't bother thinking about all the extraction issues with that or how that will be a finite supply.

                          Hilarious.

                          But sure, take the words of a guy paid millions to lie to you about this very topic who gave you no data at all over the actual data I gave below.

            • vel0city4 hours ago
              > there is only a finite amount of copper

              There is only a finite amount of oil as well.

              There is only a finite amount of aluminum and iron.

              There is only a finite amount of everything on this planet my dude.

              > has to be extracted & processed using non-renewable resources

              Technically speaking these don't always have to be entirely non-renewable processes. But let's also think: when the copper windings on some EV's motor are toast it can be recycled pretty much infinitely. How many times does that gallon of gasoline get recycled?

              Seems strange to have the copper be the thing so uniquely focused on.

              You're so focused on like 200lbs of copper that will be in the car the entire life of the car and can then be recycled after the life of the car, being so extremely concerned about how its such a finite resource. Meanwhile you just ignore than a 25mpg ICE car over a 200,000mi life will burn ~48,600lbs of gasoline, none of which is recoverable, and is also a finite resource.

              Which one should we me more concerned about using up? The one that's easily recyclable or the one that's not and will be consumed >240x as much?

              https://internationalcopper.org/sustainable-copper/about-cop...

              > Current copper resources are estimated to exceed 5,000 million tonnes

              That's ~50 billion EV cars worth of copper we roughly know about. There's probably more than that out there, we just haven't found it yet. It also just ignores all the copper we've already mined and is in the circular economy.

    • zug_zug6 hours ago
      I don't think "material math" applies to things that are huge luxury/status symbol purchases. Otherwise we'd all be driving 2005 corollas.

      And as status-symbol or identity statement, being anti-oil (or anti beholden on America, Russia, Iran, etc) seems like a pretty good one.

    • peterlada4 hours ago
      Geez, Hillsdale College. Worldwide authority on all economics from the theological perspective. Congrats on picking information sources.
      • measurablefunc3 hours ago
        Do the math & then post your own video to explain why he's mistaken.
        • 24 minutes ago
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