97 pointsby belter7 hours ago7 comments
  • SaaSasaurus37 minutes ago
    Today I had some fun digging into the Greenland tech startup ecosystem, or lack thereof https://www.siliconsnark.com/the-first-ever-deep-dive-into-g...
  • michaelhoneyan hour ago
    soon he will be dead and the slow, painful, halting recovery will begin
    • kevmauer39 minutes ago
      His mother lived to 88
  • tim333an hour ago
    It's strange how Trump wants to be pally with Russia but attack America's closest allies like Canada and Denmark.
  • moralestapia6 hours ago
    [flagged]
    • jmclnx6 hours ago
      If we had sane (or brave) people in congress, he would have been impeached and convicted by now and tossed out of office.
      • vee-kay5 hours ago
        Isn't he already convicted?
        • jmclnx5 hours ago
          By convicted I mean convicted by the Senate. After Congress impeaches the Pres., the Senate needs to have a trial and if they convict the Pres., he is removed from office.

          That did not happen in the first term.

      • euribates5 hours ago
        And into the jail
      • watwut5 hours ago
        Republican congressman uniformly support Trump and his agenda. He has full support of republican party. So do senate and so do republican supreme court justices.

        They stand up for this.

        • telotortium5 hours ago
          The Wikipedia article mentions a bipartisan delegation to Copenhagen in support of Denmark. Maybe they took along Republicans that have been a bee in the Trump administration’s bonnet, but it’s definitely not fair to say they uniformly support his agenda, only that they would rather support him than the Democrats.
      • jjkaczor5 hours ago
        [flagged]
    • BolsunBacset5 hours ago
      It is too short sighted to blame this all on Trump. The core issue is the West has abdicated its sovereignty and military to the US long ago.
      • lumost5 hours ago
        And the US in turn abdicated its separation of powers. A US president lacks the ability to make treaties, or use military force without congressional authorization.

        In what world does the president have the authority to annex an autonomous territory from an ally?

        • telotortium5 hours ago
          The world where he does it and then tries to present it to Congress as a fait accompli. If the security concerns around Greenland are seen as legitimate enough, he’ll get his Democratic congressmen to approve it, particularly as it’s unlikely that it would become a state (too few people).
        • vee-kay5 hours ago
          In the world that thinks and does: "Might is Right".

          Oh wait, that's the history of humanity - especially the bloody brutal history of Colonialism & Imperialism.

          USA (rather The Five Eyes led by USA), EU, China are not just nations or blocs. They are Empires.

          And this is what Empires do best: war (war for oil/resources, war for territory, war for wealth & glory, war for slaves, etc.)

      • wwweston5 hours ago
        The core issue is that the current US leadership has abandoned its status as a former trustworthy leader that accepted cooperation and responsibility as key operating tenets.

        If anyone threatened to take your home by force if you didn’t sell at his favorite price, the sane social discussion would focus on their uncivil threat and pro-social responses, not on victim blaming “the core issue is that I’ve abdicated my ability to defend my house by force.”

        You could have a reasonable conversation about sovereign defense budgets and alliance contributions, but not while you’re threatening the sovereignty of an ally.

        And all of this will make American citizens less safe, not more. It’s madness. There’s nothing to be gained here for most people by threat of force or hybrid warfare.

  • t1234s6 hours ago
    [flagged]
    • fastasucan5 hours ago
      Its their home. Why would you think they were?
      • _fs5 hours ago
        Its the latest manosphere talking point. Pretty much a repeat of saying all protestors are paid by George Soros and the Clintons.
        • mindslight5 hours ago
          It seems more like the little-boy-o-sphere. Who over the age of 15 is following these performative preeners who spend all day at the gym? Tough men lift steel, not iron.
        • t1234s5 hours ago
          [flagged]
          • fastasucan5 hours ago
            How do you know if I am left or right, and who is touchy? Its just ridiculous to assume they are paid to live there. It doesn't all revolve around the US.

            If anything, the Greenlanders have fought for the right to be Greenlanders.

          • mindslight5 hours ago
            "The Left" (by which I presume you mean any American who still believes in the US Constitution, individual liberty, or limited government) understands that our position as world leader hinges upon the trust of our allies, and that we already had all of the access to Greenland that we needed.
          • yongjik4 hours ago
            > "Left"

            > get so touchy about Greenland

            lmao

      • giacomoforte5 hours ago
        Americans famously don't respect native peoples and their lands.
        • nozzlegear4 hours ago
          Tbf I think you could say this for almost any European country as well.
      • t1234s5 hours ago
        I think many Alaskans are paid.
        • telotortium5 hours ago
          Alaskan Native Americans may be paid in the sense that the government provides subsidies for infrastructure and the like, but it’s seen as either welfare or necessary to allow them to keep practicing some of their native way of life. All Alaskan citizens also get a dividend from the Permanent Fund, but that’s only around $1000 a year. They are definitely not being paid to discourage Russia from invading (except for the military I suppose).
        • JohnFen5 hours ago
          There is an annual payment from the oil money, yes, but it isn't large enough to affect people's decisions about living there, nor is that the intent.
    • pengaru5 hours ago
      > Are Greenlanders paid by Denmark to live there in order to keep some sort of minimum population?

      Where were you educated?

      • t1234s5 hours ago
        It's a fair question. Greenland appears to be a very harsh place to live. Younger generations may not want to deal with that and go live in Europe.
        • ianburrell5 hours ago
          Since Greenland is part of Denmark, Greenlanders are free to move to Denmark. There are 16k or so, but can't tell how many are Greenlandic or Danish heritage.
        • Sabinus3 hours ago
          Does the American government pay people to post and push their narratives on the internet?
        • fastasucan4 hours ago
          Some people don't mind living close to nature, but rather see that as a positive. And many people seek out the same environment they grew up in, as they are used to that. Isn't it like that where you live?
        • TMWNNan hour ago
          Your question is not an unreasonable one. One fifth of all Greenlanders live in Denmark.
        • 4 hours ago
          undefined
    • TacticalCoder5 hours ago
      On the contrary: greenlanders are mostly inuits that survived the purge and sterilization done dy danes in the 1960s and 1970s. But somehow the danes are getting a free pass on this. Denmark did officially apologize if I'm not mistaken that said.
      • t1234s5 hours ago
        Are all Greenlanders considered full Danish citizens? Can they leave Greenland and move to Denmark permanently? Also can people from Denmark buy property and live full time in Greenland?
        • jltsiren4 hours ago
          Ethnic Greenlanders living in Greenland are ordinary Danish citizens. Any Danish citizen can obtain almost the same legal rights by moving to Greenland.

          Citizens of other Nordic countries can also live and work in Greenland without any permits. However, some jobs are restricted to Danish citizens who were born or raised in Greenland. EU citizens need a residence permit, because Greenland is not in the EU.

  • kelseyfrog5 hours ago
    It would be the largest welfare state in the union.
    • mrkeen4 hours ago
      > The US Geological Survey estimates that onshore northeast Greenland (including ice-covered areas) contains around 31 billion barrels of oil-equivalent in hydrocarbons

      https://theconversation.com/greenland-is-rich-in-natural-res...

      • adventuredan hour ago
        The US doesn't need oil, it's the world's largest producer and has enormous estimated recoverable oil reserves comparable to Venezuela or Russia.

        Greenland is either about Trump intentionally causing chaos with NATO for the benefit of Russia (depending on your politics), or it's the Pentagon & Co. looking to lock down strategic territory for the near future superpower stand-off with China, which will be a global conflict (and may involve China and Russia on one side). Controlling Greenland and Alaska would provide the US with enormous Arctic Ocean positioning. Now what does that have to do with China you may ask? Trade, transit and military asset positioning. The US is looking to secure what it regards as its hemisphere, while China is about to massively push outward globally with a projection navy. The US has less than ~20 years to lock down its hemisphere (again, what the US believes to be its hemisphere) before China starts showing up with its navy everywhere. There will be constant navy-navy challenges everywhere. China will constantly probe the US points of control, for all the obvious reasons. The US will want to keep China as far away as possible.

        • AlotOfReading27 minutes ago
          What Arctic access is provided by Greenland that isn't already provided by Alaska and control of the Bering strait? US naval ambitions in the Arctic are limited by the US' weak shipbuilding capacity, which it's relied on Canada and Europe to compensate for. Those are also the nations most pissed off by the US' nonsense.
          • adventured6 minutes ago
            Several things: 1) the US will deploy substantial military assets to Greenland. Far beyond what it has now. That will include building massive radar arrays and missile defense systems. By controlling Greenland it won't need permission for anything it does. 2) The US will aggressively claim water territory around Greenland and use it to restrict transit by foreign military powers. Svalbard is on the table for invasion and annexation if the US goes the route of fascism or empire. If not, then the US will just push its water territory claims to absurd lines in the style of the South China Sea and use it for denial as much as possible. 3) Greenland puts the US drastically closer to the most important regions of Russia, the US will station nuclear weapons on Greenland. Owning Greenland gets the US massive territory 3,000 KM closer to Moscow.

            The US only recognizes two threatening competitor powers in the world today: China and Russia. Russia is of course not what it was during the Soviet era. However a long-term partnership with China would change the dynamic a lot. Russian territory may come to host major Chinese ports in time. For the right price it's extremely likely that China can buy a multi port deal in the Arctic Ocean region from Russia. It'd be invaluable access & projection potential for China. Any superpower would want that realistically.

    • telotortium5 hours ago
      Welfare perhaps. State, almost certainly not. If this did come to pass, I wonder if the inhabitants would be US citizens or non-citizen nationals, like the population of American Samoa.
      • nozzlegear3 hours ago
        Not sure about the US citizens versus non-citizen nationals (I had always thought American Samoans were citizens), but you're spot on that it would certainly not be a state. The people living in Greenland would almost certainly lean blue, and the republicans would never allow the Dems to gain more de facto seats in the house and senate.
      • gherkinnn3 hours ago
        I don't think any of the Trump crowd thought as far as these legal ramifications. Send in the Little Green Men, annex, and figure things out as they happen.
  • TMWNNan hour ago
    Greenland is unbelievably, stupendously critical to US security. Consider what former SACEURs Breedlove <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtGh1kFqIoc> and Stavridis <https://thehill.com/policy/international/5081040-stavridis-s...> said about it a year ago.

    The US has militarily defended Greenland since 1941. As of 2020 Denmark's Arctic Command has one aircraft, four helicopters, four ships, and six dog sleds to patrol the entire island, three times the size of Texas.

    Greenland claims to welcome outside investment. In practice, however, Nuuk never approves anything related to resource development. More on this below.

    Denmark no longer "owns" Greenland in the way the US owns Alaska, or even Puerto Rico; Greenland can declare independence on its own at any time, unlike the latter. What the Danish parliament allowed in 2009 it can in theory undo, but Greenland can also declare independence at any time.

    While Greenland has stated its willingness to continue to host US troops after independence, there is always an uncertainty from having to depend on a foreign government.

    Annexation would also simplify US access to Greenland's natural resources, which (the SACEURs above also mention) are as vital to the US as its location is. For all of Greenland's claims that it seeks outside investment, in practice it leeches €600 million from Copenhagen annually (only for domestic use; Denmark handles all foreign/military affairs) for its 50,000 people and turns down almost every attempt to develop mines and oilfields, allegedly because of environmental concerns. And why should it allow such attempts, when it has the best of all worlds now, with Denmark and the US paying for everything?

    Greenland a) is inevitably going to gain independence—every single poll for decades has shown this—but b) is completely unable to function on its own as a bona fide independent country. Pacific islands (barely) function as independent countries because their tiny populations are commensurate with their small areas. Greenland's 50,000 people live on an island that is, as noted, three times the size of Texas. Denmark is completely unable to defend Greenland militarily (thus the US presence there in the first place); Greenland certainly cannot, given that it can't function today without the aforementioned €600 million for just domestic affairs. Given this, US annexation or affiliation is inevitable.

    "The US invading Greenland would destroy NATO!", you say. I don't believe that the US would invade Greenland militarily; it will likely buy it, affiliate with it through a Compact of Free Association à la Palau, or obtain some sort of ironclad investment rights not dependent on whether Greenland is part of the Kingdom of Denmark or independent. But let's say that the US does, and NATO dissolves.

    It comes down to net benefits. Would owning Greenland be more valuable for American national security, than the current NATO status quo of the US being willing to to accept its own cities being nuked if Russia invades Western Europe?

    The calculus made more sense (if it ever did) during the Cold War, when NATO ended at Germany's eastern border. Does it make sense now, when Montenegro is a NATO member? I strongly suspect that the answer is not one that the rest of NATO would want to hear, regardless of the Ukraine War.

    • watersb24 minutes ago
      NATO is unbelievably, stupendously critical to US security.
      • defrost16 minutes ago
        Even more so, _Trust_ is unbelievably, stupendously critical to US security.

        We now live in a world that knows for a fact a deal with the US is worth nothing and can not even be relied upon to last more than six months.

        Countries and allies that made trade deals with Trump after he destroyed existing deals are now seeing further petty tariffs being applied by what appears to be a giant baby.

        All the movements of plastic ships and little horses on a Risk map aside, the steady undercurrent of reliable trade and markets is headed out the window in an act of self defenestration.

    • tim333an hour ago
      >Greenland is unbelievably, stupendously critical to US security.

      I think the US may just remain secure without owning Greenland. I mean it's done ok so far.

      • threecheesean hour ago
        Shrinking of the ice caps is opening up a whole new theatre for trade, natural resource extraction, and more importantly conflict.
      • adventured44 minutes ago
        How about if China buys Greenland or otherwise acquires a massive port on Greenland. Maybe China builds one of the world's largest military bases on Greenland with a century deal.

        China is going to end up being every bit as powerful as the US ever was, both economically and militarily. Nothing will be off the table in what's coming. Russia has never had a true global projection navy, China will have a navy that is plausibly going to be both larger and more powerful than the US navy with full global reach. That global reach will include the entire North and South American region.

        If you're the US you look to lock down Greenland and Panama, for starters.