jQuery 4(blog.jquery.com)

291 pointsby OuterVale6 hours ago24 comments

blakewatson4 hours ago
Related: This is a nice write-up of how to write reactive jQuery. It's presented as an alternative to jQuery spaghetti code, in the context of being in a legacy codebase where you might not have access to newer frameworks.
https://css-tricks.com/reactive-jquery-for-spaghetti-fied-le...
- lioetersan hour ago
  This brought me flashbacks of jQuery spaghetti monsters from years ago, some were Backbone related. In retrospect, over-engineered React code can be worse than decently organized jQuery code, but some jQuery mess was worse than any React code. So I guess I'm saying, React did raise the bar and standard of quality - but it can get to be too much, sometimes a judicious use of old familiar tool gets the job done.
  - 33 minutes ago
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- Klaster_14 hours ago
  I used this approach before and it indeed works better than the 2010-style jQuery mess. A good fit for userscripts too, where the problem you attempt to solve is fairly limited and having dependencies, especially with a build steps, is a pain. Note that you don't need jQuery for this at all, unless you are somehow stuck with ancient browser support as a requirement - querySelector, addEventListener, innerHtml - the basic building blocks of the approach - have been available and stable for a long time.
  - doix4 hours ago
    Unfortunately, nowadays writing userscripts is much harder than it used to be. Most websites are using some sort of reactive FE framework so you need to make extensive use of mutationObservers (or whatever the equivalent is in jQuery I guess).
    hebelehubelea minute ago
    I often go for `setInterval` over `MutationObserver` because it works and I don't need instant reactivity and I don't have to think too much about it.
    egeozcan6 minutes ago
    It's easier to write with LLMs. One-off projects (the way I treat userscripts) is where they really shine.
    Oh the horrible things I do with Instagram...
    Klaster_12 hours ago
    Very true. I guess that depends on what websites you find issues with? I just checked mine and all of those are quality of life improvements for fully server rendered sites like HN or phpBB forums.
    doix2 hours ago
    Yeah, I mostly use it for QoL improvements but for work related things. So Jira, Bitbucket, GitHub, Linear etc. basically whatever my employer uses. Back in the early 2010s most of that software was fully server rendered. Nowadays it's pretty rare for that to be the case.
    I just try and get LLMs to do it for me because I'm lazy, and they like to use setInterval instead of mutationObservers and if it works, I just live with the inefficiency.
flomo2 hours ago
Whenever HTMX comes up here, I always think "isn't that just some gobbledy-gook which replaces about 3 lines of imperative jquery?"
Anyway, jQuery always did the job, use it forever if it solves your problems.
- sgt7 minutes ago
  I pretty much use HTMX and vanilla JS to solve most problems, when I use Django at least. Keeps things simple and gives that SPA feel to the app too.
- hsbauauvhabzban hour ago
  These days I’ve moved to native JS, but hot damn the $() selector interface was elegant and minimal vs document.getElement[s]by[attribute)].
  While presumably jquery is slower than native selectors, maybe that could be pre-computed away.
  - egeozcan5 minutes ago
    jQuery but gets compiled out like svelte... Not a bad idea at all.
- gbalduzzi2 hours ago
  The problem with jQuery is that, being imperative, it quickly becomes complex when you need to handle more than one thing because you need to cover imperatively all cases.
  - flomoan hour ago
    Yeah, that's the other HN koan about "You probably don't need React if..." But if you are using jquery/vanilla to shove state into your HTML, you probably actually do need something like react.
  - an hour ago
    undefined
karim795 hours ago
Still one of my favourite libs on the whole planet. I will always love jQuery. It is responsible for my career in (real) companies.
Live on jQuery! Go forth and multiply!
b3ing5 hours ago
Nice to see it still around and updated. The sad part is I guess this means React will be around in 2060.
- altern836 minutes ago
  What's wrong with React?
  It made it so much better to build apps vs. spaghetti jQuery.
  I still have nightmares about jeeping track of jQuery callbacks
- mikeaskew44 hours ago
  by 2060 React Native should be up to v0.93
- an hour ago
  undefined
- b65e8bee43c2ed05 hours ago
  there are already de facto two Reacts. by 2060, there will be five.
  - 2muchcoffeeman5 hours ago
    Two Reacts!?
    exac4 hours ago
    As someone who doesn't use React, there is React Native (for iOS & Android), and React (and that can be server-rendered or client-rendered).
    psnehanshu3 hours ago
    There's also React Native Web
    underdeserver2 hours ago
    I'm sorry what
    rauli_an hour ago
    In case you want to use React to make Web sites as well.
    atulvi2 hours ago
    There was also react vr
    tcoff914 hours ago
    class components & function components.
    afiori2 hours ago
    That is the least interesting divide in the react community
hypnotan hour ago
It's amazing how much jQuery is still used today. Even on modern websites you can often find it included (browser devtools -> jQuery in the console, and see). And not just on hobbyist sites, but on serious company websites and their web tools as well.
- KellyCriterion37 minutes ago
  Curious:
  Whats the current behemoth instead of JQ?
  I perceive it as still being the de-facto standard?
rationably6 hours ago
Unbelievably, still supports IE 11 which is scheduled to be deprecated in jQuery 5.0
- indoleringan hour ago
  It looks like it was done to not delay the 4.0 release. Since they follow semvar, that means it won't get the axe until 5.0 [1]. Pretty wild considering that 3.0 was released 10 years ago.
  But maybe they will scope this one better: they were talking about getting 4.0 released in 2020 back in 2019!
  [1]: https://github.com/jquery/jquery/pull/5077 [2]: https://github.com/jquery/jquery/issues/4299
- tartoran5 hours ago
  Backwards compatibility. Apparently there are still some people stuck on IE11. It's nice that jQuery still supports those users and the products that they are still running.
  - kstrauser2 hours ago
    This is the part that I find the strangest:
    > We also dropped support for other very old browsers, including Edge Legacy, iOS versions earlier than the last 3, Firefox versions earlier than the last 2 (aside from Firefox ESR), and Android Browser.
    Safari from iOS 16, released in 2022, is more modern in every conceivable way than MSIE 11. I'd also bet there are more people stuck with iOS 16- than those who can only use IE 11, except maybe at companies with horrid IT departments, in which case I kind of see this as enabling them to continue to suck.
    I'd vote to rip the bandaid off. MSIE is dead tech, deader than some of the other browsers they're deprecating. Let it fade into ignomony as soon as possible.
    sebazzzan hour ago
    “Support” here probably means “we’re testing jQuery for compatibility on those web browsers” - likely Safari from iOS 16 still runs this version of jQuery just fine. However, running automated test suites or support bugfixing for those clients is a lot harder than spinning up some Microsoft-provided VM with IE11 on it.
    kstrauser42 minutes ago
    Fair point.
    troupoan hour ago
    > Safari from iOS 16, released in 2022, is more modern in every conceivable way than MSIE 11.
    There are likely millions if not tens of millions of computers still running MSIE11. There are likely to be no devices running iOS 16
    kstrauser43 minutes ago
    According to Cloudflare, there are almost no users still on MSIE of any version.[0]
    Statcounter says there are about 4.6% of iOS users still on iOS 16.[1]
    My gut instinct is that there are multiple times more people using iOS 16 today than MSIE of any version.
    [0] https://radar.cloudflare.com/reports/browser-market-share-20...
    [1] https://gs.statcounter.com/os-version-market-share/ios/mobil...
    troupo18 minutes ago
    IIRC public counters tend to miss corporate networks.
    Strom26 minutes ago
    > There are likely to be no devices running iOS 16
    My iPhone X is stuck on iOS 16 with no way to upgrade.
    However, the phone is still working well. Despite being in daily use for 8 years it still has 81% battery capacity, has never been dropped, has a great OLED screen, can record 4K@60 video. It is far more responsive than a brand new 2025 $200 Android phone from e.g. Xiaomi. It still gets security patches from Apple. The only real shortcoming compared to a modern iPhone is the low light camera performance. That and some app developers don't support iOS 16 anymore, so e.g. I can't use the ChatGPT app and have to use it via the browser, but the Gemini app works fine.
  - phinnaeus5 hours ago
    Are those people/products upgrading jQuery though?
  - jbullock355 hours ago
    Who is still stuck on IE 11---and why?
    flomo2 hours ago
    There are some really retrograde government and bigcorps, running ten year old infrastructure. And if that is your customer-base? You do it. Plus I worked on a consumer launch site for something you might remember, and we got the late requirement for IE7 support, because that's what the executives in Japan had. No customers cared, but yeah it worked in IE7.
    ejmatta5 hours ago
    Some corporate machines still run XP. Why upgrade what works?
    ExpertAdvisor015 hours ago
    SECURITY
    Joel_Mckay4 hours ago
    Yet it would still run Windows Adware edition. =3
    ddtaylor5 hours ago
    I think anything still using ActiveX like stuff or "native" things. Sure, it should all be dead and gone, but some might not be and there is no path forward with any of that AFAIK.
    simondotauan hour ago
    Surely by this point someone has written a 0-day for MSIE 11 which gets root and silently installs an Internet Explorer skinned Chromium. If not, someone should get onto that. —Signed, everyone
- ulrischa3 hours ago
  Not everybody in the world can use modern hard- and software. There are tons of school computer labs running old software
  - halapro3 hours ago
    Yes, run jQuery 3.
    Crazy to think that software running inside IE11 should use the latest version of a library.
chao-3 hours ago
I cannot express how much I admire the amount of effort jQuery puts into their upgrade tools.
lrvick2 hours ago
Everything I ever used jquery for 15 years ago, I found myself able to do with the CSS and the JS standard library maybe 10 years ago. I honestly am confused when I see jquery used today for anything.
Is there still anything jquery does you cannot easily do with a couple lines of stdlib?
- simondotauan hour ago
  The terse and chainable jQuery syntax is more readable, easier to remember, and thus more pleasant to maintain. Rewriting for stdlib is easy, but bloats out the code by forcing you to pepper in redundant boilerplate on nearly every line.
- jampekkaan hour ago
  Jquery does many things in one line that requires a couple lines of stdlib. Writing less code is what libraries are for.
  - glemion43an hour ago
    Until you have to upgrade it and it bites you
    jampekkaan hour ago
    jQuery's big point was to give a consistent API over inconsistent browser implementations, so it typically saves you from bites more often than it bites you.
gethly2 hours ago
jQuery was peak JavaScript.
Good times, I'm glad it is still around.
- shevy-java2 hours ago
  It is still used by many websites.
  - marticode2 hours ago
    Indeed. Though a lot of its feature found their way into plain vanilla Javascript and browsers, the syntax is still so much easier with jQuery.
johanyc27 minutes ago
is there any reason to use jquery if you've never used it before
ulrischa2 hours ago
I still love the simplicity a ajax call can be done in Jquery
- niek_pasan hour ago
  What does jQuery provide that the Fetch API doesn’t?
jusonchan814 hours ago
The first time I truly enjoyed web development was when I got the hang of jQuery. Made everything so much simple and usable!
- Joel_Mckay4 hours ago
  jQuery made a messy ecosystem slightly less fragmented. Combined with CKEditor it effectively tamed a lot of web-developer chaos until nodejs dropped. =3
indolering3 hours ago
I love that they support ES6 modules, Trusted Types, and CSP! The clearing out of old APIs that have platform replacements is nice to see too!
shevy-java2 hours ago
I am still using jQuery.
maxpert3 hours ago
jQuery is the last time I felt a library doing magic! Nothing has matched the feelings since then.
- Minor49er3 hours ago
  Not even modern vanilla JavaScript?
  - marticode2 hours ago
    It's fairly close now but so much more verbose: ie document.getElementById('theID') vs $('#theID')
    majewskyan hour ago
    Nearly every time I write something in JavaScript, the first line is const $ = (selector) => document.querySelector(selector). I do not have jQuery nostalgia as much as many others here, but that particular shorthand is very useful.
    For extra flavor, const $$ = (selector) => document.querySelectorAll(selector) on top.
NetOpWibby4 hours ago
I remember being scared of jQuery and then being scared of vanilla JS. My, how time flies.
Incredible it's still being maintained.
MarkdownConvert5 hours ago
Long-time user here. It served me well for years, though I haven't really touched it since the 3.0 days. Glad to see it's still being maintained.
yread3 hours ago
Hmm maybe i can finally move on from 2.x
madduci3 hours ago
This is huge. jQuery is still my way to go for any website requiring some custom interaction that isn't available in vanilla js.
netbioserror5 hours ago
I was surprised that for most of my smaller use cases, Zepto.js was a drop-in replacement that worked well. I do need to try the jQuery slim builds, I've never explored that.
- NetOpWibby3 hours ago
  Zepto! That's a name I haven't heard in years. I don't remember how it happened but I'm still a member of the ZeptoJS org on Github.
  - indoleringan hour ago
    I really like that project! Why don't y'all hand it over to someone willing to do maintenance or at least archive it?
tpoacher4 hours ago
still needs more jQuery
tonijn5 hours ago
No love for $…?
gocsjess4 hours ago
jQuery is v4 now, but a lot of sites esp. wordpress still have 1.11 or 1.12 and only uses them to either doing modals(popover), show/hide(display), or ajax(fetch).
- nchmy3 hours ago
  WordPress ships with 3.x and is already looking to update to 4
maxloh5 hours ago
Even after migrating to ES modules, jQuery is still somewhat bloated. It is 27 kB (minified + gzipped) [0]. In comparison, Preact is only 4.7 kB [1].
[0]: https://bundlephobia.com/package/jquery@4.0.0
[1]: https://bundlephobia.com/package/preact@10.28.2
- topspin2 hours ago
  > Preact is only 4.7 kB
  Is there some outlier place where people using virtual DOM frameworks don't also include 100-200kb of "ecosystem" in addition to the framework?
  I suppose anything is possible, but I've never actually seen it. I have seen jQuery only sites. You get a lot for ~27kB.
  - downsplat37 minutes ago
    I do that when I need to make a simple SPA. Plain Vue plus a few tiny add-ons of my own.
- onion2k5 hours ago
  jQuery does a lot more though, and includes support older browsers.
  - halapro3 hours ago
    > includes support older browsers
    Which is entirely the issue. Supporting a browser for the 10 users who will update jQuery in 2025 is insane.
    mejutoco2 hours ago
    Breaking backwards compatibility to turn 27kb into less because of "bloat" makes less sense to me.
    shevy-java2 hours ago
    It is definitely more than 10 users.
  - ZeroAurora2 hours ago
    Officially they state they only support 2 latest versions of chrome. But considering their support of IE11, that's actually a lot.