9 pointsby alephnerd21 days ago3 comments
  • al_borland21 days ago
    Tricks like this to get people into a home who aren’t financially ready for it is not a blessing, it’s a curse.

    I also found it odd that the article kept referencing “investors”. The goal should be affordable homes for normal people who need housing, not real estate investors.

    • Teknomadix21 days ago
      Anybody who is a saving money in a 401(k) is essential investing.

      After reading the article, it appears clear that the the administration advisers are saying the new housing plan would let buyers tap 401(k) funds for a home down payment without the usual early-withdrawal penalty. Germany has something very similar to this policy and it has been widely lauded as a success.

      My take: For median-income households, the plan under discussion would let individuals pull money from a 401(k) for a home down payment withoutl penalty or taxes, helping buyers overcome the big upfront cost that often stands between them and their first home. Because 401(k) loans or withdrawals today generally trigger substantial taxes and penalties if you’re under 59.5 years old, this change could meaningfully reduce that barrier and broaden the access to homeownership immediately upon enactment. Beyond just tapping savings, the advisers are speculating the administration might include a mechanism to reinvest home equity back into the 401(k) retirement account over time, for example, by allowing a portion of home value growth to count as an asset inside the 401(k) so that the account “grows” alongside the house, offsetting retirement savings losses caused by the withdrawal. Those mechanics, like how much can be withdraw, whether there are caps or limits, how repayment would work, or whether it applies only to first-time buyers, are still being worked out and haven’t been finalized so Caveat emptor; this is speculation on my part based on the read. I like the idea and I'll be contacting my US state representatives with my endorsement and recommendations including the proposed first-time buyer restriction.

      • al_borland21 days ago
        My fear with tapping the 401k to fund purchases during one’s working years would be a bit hit to the money they actually have for retirement. Taking out $80k today, at a 7% rate of return, would be over $600k in 30 years.

        If someone is in a great housing market, and is willing to downsize in retirement, maybe it works out, but there is luck mixed in there… along with personality and emotion. Your idea of rolling some equity into the 401k is an interesting one that may help quell some fears. Of course the devil is in the details, and if it requires some complicated work on the part of the buyer once the home value has grown, I can see a lot of people missing out on such a program.

        • tim-tday20 days ago
          Most people who need to do this live in a high cost of living area and the investment in a house increases at a higher rate than the stock market in those cities.
        • yomby20 days ago
          Depending on where you buy, those $80k can be rising at a little over 7% in appreciation over the 30 years too.
          • al_borland20 days ago
            That’s true, that’s why my mentioned the possibility of luck. But also the willingness to downsize as a means to pull money out of the home, as that real estate appreciation won’t put food on the table. HELOCs and reverse mortgages, as means to get money out, both seem predatory. Those are non-starters for me.

            My dad talked about potentially downsizing to a condo about 5 years ago, but hasn’t done it and I don’t think he ever will. There is too much identity and emotion tied to owning a nice home for him.

    • alephnerd21 days ago
      Reuters is a business news wire like Bloomberg, so the impact on businesses is always included in reports. Additionally, these kinds of moves do have an impact on various portions of the financial market - from loan underwriting to lending to real estate sales.

      Germany also enacted a similar law back in 2008, allowing for the Wohn-Riester, which is basically a 401k but for home purchases or paying off your principal. Allowing a 401k to be used for both retirement and home purchases allows for it to become a unified Riester.

  • tim-tday20 days ago
    I think this is actually a good idea. I purchased a home and it was the most sensible and stabilizing financial move of my life. Being able to tap my 401k would have allowed me to do it earlier and achieve that stability sooner.
    • tossandthrow18 days ago
      Would this also have been the case had the housing price gone down for you? Or if the housing price had just been flat?

      These single use tricks make sure that the housing market will go up for yet another couple of year. But every time a trick like this is applied, it will increase the risk in the system. There are also the issue that there are only that many tricks one can use.

  • techblueberry21 days ago
    Geez, we’ll do anything but build more housing.

    But seriously, anything that increases demand, like making it easier to buy a house using your 401k just increases house prices. Where are all the “rent control is bad economics” folks now?

    • Teknomadix21 days ago
      Since nothing is finalized, the same framework could just as plausibly be extended beyond buying existing homes to using 401(k) funds as a down payment toward building a new one, which would be especially relevant for median-income buyers priced out of tight resale markets but able to access land or lower-cost construction pathways; in that version, retirement savings could seed new housing supply rather than just bid up existing stock, and any future “re-vesting” mechanism that’s been hinted at could theoretically allow part of the home’s appreciated value, or structured repayments tied to equity growth, to flow back into the retirement account over time, reframing the withdrawal less as a permanent depletion and more as a reallocation from paper assets into a productive, shelter-providing one that later migrates back into long-term retirement capital. This is a very smart economic policy reform.
    • alephnerd21 days ago
      > Where are all the “rent control is bad economics” folks now

      Complaining about zoning even though in a large portion of America, zoning is orthogonal to housing affordability [0] and supply, especially because no bank wants to finance residential real estate anymore - they'd all rather invest in commercial real estate which has better and more consistent returns (logistics parks, data centers, factories during CHIPS and IRA) [1].

      [0] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42543143

      [1] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42544296