65 pointsby pseudolus2 days ago6 comments
  • jepj572 days ago
    Looks like much ado about nothing. This was already proposed and shot down on 2020, and Justice Scalia has already commented in a 2013 case that this is not a good idea.

    Call your Congress critters and let them know how you feel. This is just institutional creep that, like an invasive plant, needs to be pruned back from time to time.

  • blurbleblurble2 days ago
    3, 2, 1 flagged
    • frumplestlatz2 days ago
      [flagged]
      • onemoresoopa day ago
        Good? I think outrage to such a thing is warranted and is technology related.
        • frumplestlatza day ago
          [flagged]
          • tartorana day ago
            What's your point?
            • frumplestlatza day ago
              That HN doesn't need to turn into yet another leftist-oriented firehose of outrage porn. There are plenty of options for that elsewhere.
              • mindslight11 minutes ago
                Perhaps places have seemingly turned "leftist" because the fascist definition of "leftist" has turned into anyone who doesn't support summary executions of American citizens in the street?
              • tartorana day ago
                You clearly have an ax to grind with leftists but outrage is a human reaction to something bad happening, it can be perceived on any political spectrum, including right as well. And discussion is the only a good thing even if not everybody agrees, at least we understand where they stand.
                • frumplestlatza day ago
                  I have an axe to grind with outrage porn in general, and it so happens that leftist outrage porn is the prevailing form.
                • pstuarta day ago
                  There's also the fact that as the audience is heavily composed of tech workers, we're helping to build these systems and should explore what our participation means for us. Hacking humanity and civilization as it were.
      • bigyabai2 days ago
        I agree, but technically-salient articles like this are explicitly on-topic in the HN guidelines. Setting aside the outrage, this is worth discussion from technically-minded individuals.

        If topics like this make you too emotional to participate, you can just ignore it. Nobody is forcing you to respond to things that make you upset.

        • frumplestlatz2 days ago
          Technically salient? How?

          Regardless, I already flag articles like this to hide them from my front page. I sometimes comment because I’d prefer a world where I didn’t have to do that.

          Like I said, there are already plenty of sources for this kind of content. We don’t really need HN to be yet another Reddit or Bluesky.

      • stogota day ago
        Reddit homepage is ICE ICE ICE ICE all the way down. I come here for something else
        • So you're just gonna wait until ICE comes to your community to deal with it?
          • frumplestlatza day ago
            There's nothing that needs to be dealt with. This is what people voted for.
            • willmarch16 hours ago
              Not if they are acting outside the bounds of the law.
              • frumplestlatz16 hours ago
                They’re not. The deportations will continue regardless of the tantrums of the hysterical and mentally ill.
                • willmarch15 hours ago
                  They absolutely are but based on your insulting and condescending comment no amount of facts or evidence would convince you otherwise until their boot is on your own neck
                  • frumplestlatz6 hours ago
                    They’re absolutely not; your type has been repeating this nonsense for literally 12 years now.

                    The sky isn’t falling, chicken little. However, your emotional disregulation is still being used as a convenient political tool, even after all these years.

                    • willmarch5 hours ago
                      The rise of Nazi Germany took roughly 14-16 years, so I'd say we're about right on schedule based on the current timeline. Maybe you should study history more and spew partisan edgelord nonsense less, but you wouldn't really have much of an identity at all then, would you?
                      • frumplestlatz4 hours ago
                        The fact that you believe that we’re in a Weimar era tells me everything I need to know about your historical knowledge — and extreme lack of emotional regulation.

                        Get a grip. You’re not a freedom fighter, this isn’t 1920s Weimar Germany, Trump isn’t Hitler, and everything is going to be fine.

                        If anything, the greatest risk of destabilization comes from the left, where politicians are more than happy to induce and exploit your mental illness for political gain.

                        • willmarch4 hours ago
                          The lady doth protest too much, methinks... Struggles with your mental health in the past? Do you want to talk about it? It's nothing to be ashamed of...

                          Also, history might not repeat, but it certainly does rhyme. :)

                          • frumplestlatz4 hours ago
                            > … no amount of facts or evidence would convince you otherwise until their boot is on your own neck

                            Only one of us is in hysterics here.

                            And in 3 years, when everything is still just fine, you’ll be all wound up about the next thing.

                            • willmarch4 hours ago
                              Dude, you're practically frothing at the mouth rambling about mental health in nearly every post and talking about some imagined left destabilization of the world. Are you okay? You can ask for help. You don't have to struggle with this obsession by yourself. There are professionals for this sort of thing.
                              • frumplestlatz3 hours ago
                                > … no amount of facts or evidence would convince you otherwise until their boot is on your own neck

                                > The rise of Nazi Germany took roughly 14-16 years, so I'd say we're about right on schedule based on the current timeline.

                                I appreciate you trying to save face, but this is what you were posting just a few messages up.

                                Pretending to be reasonable works better when we can’t read the detached-from-reality things you were literally just posting.

                                If we were really on the cusp of a new post-Weimar NSDAP Germany, almost any form of resistance would be ethically justified. Is that what you’re claiming?

                                • willmarch3 hours ago
                                  It's only natural for you to try to deflect away from discussing your own clear struggles with neurosis and insecurities about your own mental health, but I really do feel like you'd benefit from leaning into this moment and maybe discovering why you're unable to hold a discussion without resorting to overly transparent attempts at painting anyone that disagrees with you as mentally unwell rather than engaging with anything of substance. It speaks to a deeply rooted issue in your psyche where you must project your own fears and worries about your mental health on to others rather than face your own ignorance and a lack of basic maturity that is unbecoming of someone of your age.

                                  I'm guessing you struggle to keep longterm relationships because you blame all of your issues on other people rather than being able to self-reflect on your own flaws and, because of your own supreme confidence in your own flawed judgement, it drives everyone away that might care about you. Is it hard to be that miserable and unlikeable? I'm sure it is, but the good news is that you can work on yourself and you can improve your relations with your fellow humans. It is possible to change and grow.

                                  • frumplestlatz2 hours ago
                                    Now you just seem ridiculous and mentally ill.

                                    Let me repeat. If we were really on the cusp of a new post-Weimar NSDAP Germany, almost any form of resistance would be ethically justified. Is that what you’re claiming?

                                    • willmarchan hour ago
                                      It’s revealing that you need that little morality-play false dilemma to avoid the actual topic.

                                      You’ve used “mentally ill” the way other people use citations: as a substitute for substance. It doesn’t make you the adult in the room, it just makes you look like someone who can’t defend a position without trying to pathologize disagreement.

                                      Here’s one fact you can’t hand-wave away: DHS/USCIS is proposing to expand biometrics collection (including DNA) to people merely “associated with” an immigration benefit request (explicitly including petitioners/sponsors/signatories, i.e., often U.S. citizens) regardless of age.

                                      So, you can either argue why sweeping citizens into government biometric/DNA collection for paperwork is normal and lawful, or you can keep doing the “everyone who disagrees with me is unstable” routine. One of those is an argument; the other is a tell.

                                      • frumplestlatz2 minutes ago
                                        Plenty of people disagree with me who aren’t mentally unstable.

                                        They’re just not the ones talking about “boots on the throat” and this being the rise of a new Nazi regime.

                                        You don’t get to claim wild things like that, and then pretend you never did. Nobody buys your uno reverse attempt.

      • witte2 days ago
        [dead]
  • pstuart2 days ago
    Where's the outrage from all the people flying Gadsden flags (the coiled rattlesnake with the motto "Don't tread on me"?)

    This is governmental overreach and should concern everybody regardless of political affiliation.

    • taeric2 days ago
      Realistically, it takes ringleaders to get a circus. As such, I can only assume that the lack of show online is that the people that would be the ringleaders are largely the ones currently getting what they want.

      I'm cynical enough that I think this is fairly clear evidence that some political affiliations are less sincere than others, but very few people will acknowledge this.

    • danudey2 days ago
      Those people aren't being tread on; as long as the government is only treading on "others" (i.e. liberals, and minorities) then they're completely fine with throwing out the entire constitution. They've been told that these people are trying to destroy their country. and they're happy with the government burning down everything that makes America "America" if it means that the people they've been taught to hate end up suffering.

      I can guarantee that the people who argue that the second amendment is more important than keeping people from mass-murdering school children would happily cheer on the government if they started confiscating guns from "the enemy".

      • mindslight15 minutes ago
        > I can guarantee that the people who argue that the second amendment is ... important ... would happily cheer on the government if they started confiscating guns from "the enemy".

        Something very close already happened. It wasn't confiscation, but rather with the exact scenario of night time home defense they always trot out. Kenneth Walker lawfully exercised his second amendment right to night time home defense and the government jackboots breaking down the door retaliated by using the place as a shooting gallery, resulting in the death of Breonna Taylor. Rather than realizing hey, this could easily happen to us when exercising our cherished second amendment rights, most of the second amendment fundamentalist types then rallied around the government agents who committed the murder.

        I think the hypocrisy and lack of reasoning ability is strong to begin with, but I think con artist Grump also has an uncanny knack for making gullible people rationalize anything.

      • scarecrowbob2 days ago
        Yeah, in general that flag is not the full sentence: "Don't tread on me, but the government sucks because it doesn't tread on you hard enough."
    • dc3962 days ago
      Wrong tribe. The outrage is reserved for the D-tribe actors (e.g., imagine the reaction if this was done in the Biden or Obama administrations), not the R-tribe, at least until members of the R-tribe are personally and individually impacted.
    • bb882 days ago
      The untrained eye at a distance can't tell the difference between the snake and the poo emoji.
      • drcongo2 days ago
        Best not to tread on either of them.
    • 11235813212 days ago
      The libertarians I know are upset about ICE, Gaza and Venezuela and seem to post angrily online a lot. However, they don’t seem to be joining in on the largest protests that are typically coded for Democratic-party and leftward. I don’t know what it would take to see political unification in mass protests.
      • chung81232 days ago
        In general the parties don't like the other party and insult each other. It is funny if you are trying to get someone to come over to your side insulting them isn't the best technique. If you are just trying to keep your base riled up insulting the other side seems to work.
        • pstuart2 days ago
          That's a wide brush you're painting with. While I could be easily characterized as being on a particular side because of the values I hold, I abhor tribalism and hew to the truth of the values as I best understand them.

          I've had extremely respectful dialog with others who don't embrace my values and I find their reasoning to be specious at best.

          I have respect for old school conservatism that advocates for limited government but contemporary conservatives no longer seem to care about that (except if it's programs they don't like).

          My initial comment still stands: the governmental action of the OP is intended purely to be oppressive and it will not be wielded with any sense of propriety.

          • chung81232 days ago
            If we are talking about the general political parties it is going to be a wide brush. To the original point there are some that hate the tribalism and some will join the protests just based on their own personal views. My opinion was that it is not wide spread though because of the insults that the political parties throw back and fourth making joining a joint protest unwelcoming. Friendships across the political lines is rare.
            • pstuarta day ago
              I don't buy the "both sides" argument anymore (except for corruption by party leadership). The fact that conservative stalwarts have left the GOP shows we're in new territory.

              I abhor partisan politics and am more than happy to point out flaws on the Left but we've gone through the looking glass on the Right. It's literally a cult of personality and I take no pleasure in saying that.

              While a two party system is not a good thing (George Washington warned us about political parties), having proper debate over policies and ideas is a good thing to have and we no longer have that. I've followed American politics for half a century and can unequivocally state that the situation we have here is not normal.

  • indycliff2 days ago
    Gattaca, the movie, was way ahead of its time.
  • shevy-java2 days ago
    It is essentially Project2025, which in turn is based on the rule of corporations and the superrich, executed by the TechBro oligarchs and the orange sleepy king. Amazing that the US citizens allow this to happen, even more so after the recent ICE "incident" (the video is clear, yet all those "government" posers tried to reframe the narrative into a lie - the video is so clear that you have to ask yourself why that "government" lies to the people systematically. 2 + 2 = 5, evidently).
    • frumplestlatz2 days ago
      Have you read Project 2025? I've read a fair amount of it, and I don't recall this being its focus, or any of this being part of its policy recommendations.

      Which sections in particular should I go re-read?