This object makes sense to me only if, even if there is a
display, which is fundamentally different than tracing line
with the CRT raster, at least that original process is simulated.
Yes to all of that, but also, I think a raster display of sufficiently high DPI can simulate a vector display very well, if and only if they pay attention to the right things. A vector display is visually unique for a few reasons.- The lines themselves which are honestly the easiest part to fake if the DPI is high enough, past the point of visual distinction.
- The "bloom" or "glow" (phosphor bleed, or whatever the right term is) around the lines
- The temporal effects caused by the screen phosphor continuing to glow even after the beam no longer hits them. The most obvious example is the "streak" left behind the ultra-bright moving bullets in Asteroids which looks absolutely awesome
I have seen incredible examples of vector/CRT emulation when people get creative with RetroArch (or whatever) GPU powered shaders.The only things that emulation can't match (for me) are input latency and the magic of knowing that the process of creating the image is "real" and not "faked."
I lived through the 70s and 80s and nothing is the same as CRTs and actual vector graphics the way they were meant to be: shooting electrons at your head, making your eyes red, probably increasing cancer rates, and looking fucking awesome. Nothing beats them. I miss TV snow and I miss real vector graphics.
Agreed. I'd add to your list the unique way vector displays are brighter and have more bloom at the intersections where two line endpoints overlap due to being double traced.
The games were nothing to write home about, but the rendering was fun.
You could emulate it with a slow rendering and fade (clear frame with black 99% opacity), but it would have to be perfect. Still, you'd never get the same glow on the drawing point.
built-in 5-inch AMOLED display with a resolution of 800×600, delivering sharp and bright vector graphics
And my first thought was "but if it has a resolution of 800x600, then they're not vector graphics, are they"I played many hours on a Vectrex, and I'd say that the true vector graphics was the spirit.
If this project is able to capture that spirit in 800x600 AMOLED, that will be very impressive, and I will be curious how they did it.
Edit: The Vectrex was a nice piece of creative engineering, within the constraints and opportunities of the time, on a wonderful product. I suppose (if you look at the comments here) it's difficult to make an homage to such a beloved thing, and hit the best notes in how you reveal it. This Mini looks impressive, and hopefully recaptures some of the magic.
AMOLED
<closes tab>
I would pay a LOT for a true vector display, and I would pay even more than that for a vector display systems that can play faithful recastings of Tempest and Asteroids.
I can already play vector games on rasterized displays. I don't need an injection molded cabinet.
So ... NOT vector graphics. Rasterized bitmap versions of vector graphics.
EDIT: Sorry, I'm not saying this isn't cool. I know rasterizing a vector to a sharp bitmapped display can still allow effects to simulate continuously drawn vector artifacts e.g. thin lines, thicker at vertices, refresh, flicker, etc.
I have a working Vectrex I found on the street 12 years ago sitting in my living room.
The screen was what really made it, and I get that having a vector scope manufactured would be expensive (it isn't true that nobody makes CRTs any more, but it is true that they don't come cheaply). Its also the reason I never really went all the way and bought one of my all time favorite arcade games which was the cockpit version of 'Star Wars' with its color vector display. (even harder to store!)
In a related effort, I looked at replicating a CRT "look" for some older test equipment that came with CRTs using a high dpi IPS display. I probably could have succeeded if I had an FPGA for doing the phosphor simulation (I developed a lot of respect for Tektronix's DPO technology and their patent portfolio on same :-). Very much a diminishing returns kind of thing.
[1] If you're that guy and reading this say "hi" :-)
In related news, atari 2600 emulators are keeping 4-8 cores > 50% busy these days. How else do you get accurate ntsc “red blur”, and capacitor effects from blinking pixels?
Here's a DIY example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdo3djJrw9o
I suppose you could even point that at a screen with phosphors on it for a more CRT-like effect. (Maybe you'd need a different kind of phosphor since you'd be exciting it with visible light rather than with an electron beam, though.)
Do we? I was under the impression that CRTs were not being manufactured anywhere anymore. I could definitely be wrong, but I couldn't find anything with a quick search.
https://www.thomaselectronics.com/
But they're only building them for specialty niche military and industrial applications (e.g., replacement parts for old fighter jet HUDs). You could ask them about building one for your SNES setup or old arcade machine, but it'll cost you call-for-pricing dollars (tens or hundreds of thousands, perhaps?)
> Experience the spirit of the original Vectrex in a modern, compact format.
Emphasis on "spirit" I guess? Without the vector display it's an emulator in an (admittedly) handsome enclosure.
This alone still wouldn't remotely resemble a real vector display...
They would also need to accurately simulate the glow/bloom of the lines, and the phosphor decay rate over time that leads to effects like the "trail" behind the bullets in Asteroids. That is all extremely feasible. In a lot of ways, much easier than emulating a raster CRT display.
However, I have never seen a commercial emulation product do this with any competency.
Presumably because the number of people who would actually care is not large enough to affect the sales figures in any meaningful way.
and combined with slow-decay phosphors made for some beautiful "trail" effects
Thank you. This is such an under-appreciated aspect of vector games' unique look on real hardware. A pixelated display of any sort can only yield a rough approximation at best.
Why do you feel this way? With sufficient DPI, to me this is fairly easy to achieve. A few examples of emulation that look like they're doing a very good job:I think they have the bloom dialed up way too high, and maybe the trails aren't prominent enough, but I assume those are easy things to tweak.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4lHsVueSj0
I'm not sure about the Vectrex CRT, it may have longer persistence phosphor.
What I’m curious is how far they can push the brightness and how quickly the processor can fade the whole frame buffer.
Yeah, Vectrex was a vector gaming platform (as opposed to bitmap) that came and went in the 80's. Vector arcade games were a kind of niche anyway — like "Asteroids", "Battlezone", "Tempest" and a Star Wars game. But they were also kind of magical. The Vectrex captured that.
That crazy glow was just so sci-fi for us kids back then. Some of us only had Game & Watch (LCD cells) to play with - the rich kids with their Vectrex were constant subjects of envy among us nerd kids.
I was lucky enough to get a microcomputer for one of my teenage birthdays - my rich neighbor had a Vectrex. We both kind of tired of our respective systems and on occasion would swap for the weekend .. it was great to have some actual games to play, and my friend enjoyed learning to program on my Oric-1 (which had a distinct lack of titles, at least in my neck of the woods back then ..)
First game I saw with merely lean based controls was hang on or space harrier, several years later.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say you found a highly custom cabinet, and I'm jealous.
Basically the only new principle involved is that instead of cathode ray beams always scanning on a fixed rectangular pattern, the X and Y deflection amounts were provided by the game to move around the singular dot to desired locations.
It's crisp as waving around a laser pointer. Some people like that aesthetics.
As a kid, i had the 3D goggles. The rollercoaster simulation was pretty good!
This is a fascinating feature .. so the new controller can be used on older Vectrex(es)? Nice!
I sure look forward to seeing new Vectrex titles released once the Vectrex Mini hits the scene and lands in the right hackers’ hands. Will there be some kind of open SDK or something, for this purpose - anyone know?
You need a XY Monitor - https://jmargolin.com/xy/xymon.htm
or if you have a normal CRT, you can add the XY kit: https://www.retrorgb.com/vector-monitor-xy-kit.html
Also, I’m pretty sure this was the only Vectrex within ~40,000km^2 of where I grew up.
Seriously, it's clear to see way ahead of its release there is zero chance this thing will replicate the unique experience of the vectrex.
This is just a cheap cash grab which will misrepresent what the vectrex was all about and what playing it felt like. Add this to the pile of worthless nostalgia devices.
There is just no reason for this to exist other to exploit the nostalgia and then immediately disappoint the owner of this product.
How on earth is this better than a raspberry pi with an emulator and an oled monitor? Who the hell needs this vendor to put it a box? Did you notice "injection mold plastic" is literally the first and most prominent feature of this thing? What an utter abysmal joke.
I wish these poor remakes and nostalgia releases fully commit to what they're trying to do. If you can't, just don't do it! We don't need your facsimile junk.
https://youtu.be/AKf-k2IjUOo?t=604
Personal conclusion: meh.